Regarding Critical Hits

[mordraneth]

Hi,

Just wanted some clarification after reading some of the dev crit topics, and this isn't about dev crit except in the most cursory of manners, and about how someone said that with a 12-20 threat range you'd be critting 45% of the time.

It was my understanding that for a critical hit to occur that you had to roll a natural 20 on attack first, and then make a roll within your 12-20 range.

Is that correct or am I totally misinformed?

DM's feel free to lock this as soon as I have a correct answer

Mord

[JesterOI]

The base attack roll of 12-20 would trigger a threat roll. Then if the threat roll is high enough to beat the creatures ac, it becomes a critical hit and the damage multiplier is implimented.

The natural roll of 20 to get a crit is what we had in pre-3rd edition rules.

[DrakhanValane]

Because Jester is very inaccurate (well slightly):

If you roll a 12-20 on the d20 portion of your attack roll AND your attack hits, you trigger a threat roll. Then if the threat roll hits the target you critical else it's a normal hit. That's assuming a 12-20 threat. replace the 12-20 in the example with your actual threat. :)

You could actually get a critical on 19-20 or 18-20 in 2e with the Player's Options rules. :)

Edit: I just thought I'd also throw in that if someone has an AC above your highest attack (20+AB) you'll still get a crit on two 20s in a row (and it wouldn't matter if you were a Level 1 with a warhammer or a level 16 Rapier WM you'd have the same chance of critting). :)

[Lothy]

exactly what drakhan said

[mordraneth]

Hi,

Thanks for the replies.

So to be concise

If BAB+bonuses+d20 > mob AC (and d20 roll was within crit range) you hit (assuming no other effects) and cause a threat roll.

To get a crit you then make same roll as above and if you hit it applies multiplier.

Have I got it right now?

Mord

[JesterOI]

Right, but the second roll only needs to hit the enemy, it doesn't need to be in the threat range.

[mordraneth]

Hi,

Right, think I've got it.
Thanks for the info.

Mord

[garrykasparov]

Is it just me or does the 20/20 situation seem to occur far more frequently than the 1/400 chance that is its due? I remember getting critted three times a row by natural 20s (i.e. 6 nat. 20's in a row) and thinking the odds of that should be along the lines of 1 in a million. I wish I had the same kind of odds IRL for winning the lottery (but not being struck by lightning).

[Gil-Este]

if the weapon's threat range is 20, then the first roll has to be a 20, but the second roll can be anything that, with the attacker's AB, beat's your AC.

for example, if my AB is +4, your AC is 22, and i roll i natural 20, i have scored a critical threat. my next roll does not have to be a natural 20 but only has to be an 18 or higher to critical you, otherwise its just a normal hit. and a bunch of weapons score a threat on more than just a natural 20. if you use a rapier (18-20), make it keen (15-20), take improved critical (12-20), and become a WM (10-20) you score a threat on a hit of 10 to 20, although only 20 is an auto hit.

[bongoblue]

Hmm. My personal experience on dice rolls is that it can happen to have dice rolls more often than statictics claims it can happen.

In many years of PnP gaming, I've seen more than one player roll up, without using cheat dice, a character with more than one 18 stat. Several players rolled two thru four 18s in a row.

It does happen more than 1/1,000,000 chances.

Other times they couldn't roll over a 12 with 3d6 or 4d6.

I realize a d20 is a bell curve of numbers, but there can be runs of certain numbers that appear to defy statistics.

[JesterOI]

That's probably because the game uses "random" numbers from the computer.
The numbers aren't really random though because it's just a huge list of numbers that it cycles through.
Atleast that's how it was explained to me once about random numbers on computers.

Dice would be better, but a computer can't use those in a feasible way for the game.

Even still with my psy powers I can will the dice to roll up a certain range of numbers, so they wouldn't be much use for randomness either.