pimp my build: listen or spellcraft?

disastro · Post by **disastro** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:21 am

I've got a battle bard that has a choice: listen dump or spellcraft dump (wont have spot at all). with amplify I can get 64 listen + whatever listen gear is out there. the idea is to be effective vs the HIPSters in pvp.

conversely, the spellcraft dump would give +8 to saves vs spells, which should come in handy. I scrapped my last attempt at this build after 27 levels: my piss poor saving throws made the character unworkable. this version sports much better saves (base about 20/20/20 at level 28 with mediocre eq) but now I am gun-shy about saving throws after getting pwnd SO many times on the last toon.

so what's your pick for a pvp effectiveness? if listen on it's own won't be enough (or if 70-ish listen will suck anyway), then the choice could be made right there.

Lorkar1 · Post by **Lorkar1** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:25 am

Having just those as choices I would go with listen but then I would choose a race with spell resistance to offset the loss of spellcraft.

Post by **Binkyuk** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:30 am

as it stands i wouldn't worry about saves in the long run. the epic save progression ramps saves up hugely compared to DCs, so unless something changes (which it might) then at level 40 you'll be practically immune to save based spells anyway.

kingfatzo · Post by **kingfatzo** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:43 am

except for high fort saves... like vs the n000blet stunning fist

i am always a fan of high saves , as opposed to a sopt/listen focus only because how often is it that these really come in handy unless you devote a great deal of focus into it.....

if you are going up against a good hipser, chances are you wont be able to spot him anyway, unless you have focus and epic focus in spot / listen...

disastro · Post by **disastro** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:35 pm

kingfatzo wrote: if you are going up against a good hipser, chances are you wont be able to spot him anyway, unless you have focus and epic focus in spot / listen...

yeah i got destroyed by stunning fist several times, unfortunately spellcraft wont help there.

now the epic skill focus comment is interesting. I have skill focus taunt lined up for the uber taunting, (44 base + esf taunt (10) + eq (21ish) + bard song/curse song/stats == about 80 taunt). am I overbuying on taunt? maybe that esf is better spent on listen.

i figure any decent caster is going to have a minimum of 60 concentration, and i want to be able to nail anybody with it.

Post by **Binkyuk** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 2:33 pm

actually with clairaudience, amplify, bard song and curse song going, and with an AoE greater dispel to get rid of scroll cast camo and owtl, a bard probably has about the best chance of anyone to see a SD.
of course it won't matter anyway thanks to the action queue bug, best you'll be able to do is neutralise them with it.

Post by **TheBestDeception** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 2:54 pm

Binkyuk wrote:and with an AoE greater dispel to get rid of scroll cast camo and owtl

That was fixed? Greater Dispell used to always just fizzle into nothingness when cast as AoE...

JesterOI · Post by **JesterOI** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 7:13 pm

If you take Taunt max the heck out of it, or just don't take it at all.

If you can taunt Shiv, you're off to a good start

P. Fricebottle · Post by **P. Fricebottle** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:17 pm

Gary doesn't have spot nor listen, and he kills SDs just fine. The key to killing SDs isn't Spot or Listen, because due to Bioware they can keep spamming the Stealth Mode button until they succeed. Once they do, it clears your Actions. AoE spells can be targeted where SDs are at, so you don't worry about them being canceled and they don't need to spot the SD to hurt him.

-BannyD- · Post by **-BannyD-** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:53 pm

P. Fricebottle wrote:Gary doesn't have spot nor listen, and he kills SDs just fine. The key to killing SDs isn't Spot or Listen, because due to Bioware they can keep spamming the Stealth Mode button until they succeed. Once they do, it clears your Actions. AoE spells can be targeted where SDs are at, so you don't worry about them being canceled and they don't need to spot the SD to hurt him.

that still allows them to run away and heal...have to spot them if you actually want to remove them as a threat...or score a lucky implosion on a [censored] SD.

But back on topic...go with spellcraft. 64listen WITH a 20 listen buff is just terrible and wont spot anyone worthy of playing an SD

Post by **Sparky** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 9:30 pm

My Bards tend to have enough skillpoints to afford Spellcraft and Listen, and a Bard is the best SD wrecker in the game, baring a Hasted Dragon Shifted Druid.

A Bard with a full skillpoint investment in Listen should have absolutely no problems spotting SD's with listen and then countering them effectively, no matter how often they spam HIPS.

JesterOI · Post by **JesterOI** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 9:37 pm

Especially an elf bard using a ranged weapon.

Post by **Sparky** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 10:05 pm

Agreed Jester, an Elf Bard would be incredibally hard pressed to lose to a SD.

-BannyD- · Post by **-BannyD-** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 10:57 pm

my favorite is to use a better SD to take out SDs. They cant see you, you can see them deal. Makes for a much bigger surprise than a bard who is likely able to see the SD but the SD knows where to run.