Enough Whining already
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MaxOverdrive
- Noob
- Posts: 12
- Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 6:08 pm
Enough Whining already
I've been playing neversummer 4 for a while now and one really irritating aspect of it is all the whining that goes on in the forums. Particularly irritating is whining aimed at the designers and DM's. Wake up people! They are providing this excellent server to you for FREE! It's not like your paying $10 a month like some massive multiplayer games. These guys devote a lot of time and energy to this server and they deserve our support. Also, it's OPEN BETA. That means they are still in the process of molding the server into it's final form. They are making improvements, fixing bugs, and spending a lot of time so that all of us can have a good time playing. Instead of whining how about adding to the Ideas and Suggestions forum or make a contribution to the bug report area. Whining accomplishes nothing. So if you don't have anything helpful to say please remain mute.
A GREAT IDEA!!! *SARCASM*
More than people complaining about NS4, I hate people (like this j@ck@ss!) that complain about complainers... for christ's sake... by the time this "beta" is finished no one will be playing this game... a little criticism (within reason) hopefully prods along the development. Everyone here wants to play on a complete, finished product and a little criticism hasn't killed anyone yet. What happened to free speech? Who are you? Mao Tse-Tung?
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sep caldessian
- Wheres the donation box?
- Posts: 190
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:48 am
Wake up, people
I think the thing people don't understand is that the game is not finished yet and if you want to play it, then you are playing it to test the beta out... it's not supposed to have everything fixed or everything fun in it yet. People are getting angry and leaving about this but if you want to leave. leave. You don't have to be a tester for beta.
And hopefully everyone will realize when NS4 actually does come out of the forsaken place we like to call beta?!? that this game will be fun and interesting and a new experience unlike any other server.
And hopefully everyone will realize when NS4 actually does come out of the forsaken place we like to call beta?!? that this game will be fun and interesting and a new experience unlike any other server.
-Once known as "Stealth"-
Souldin Reijn now adays
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"Shutup and eat your cheese sandwitch."
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Souldin Reijn now adays
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"Shutup and eat your cheese sandwitch."
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And the on the flip side of the coin, you people need to understand THEIR point of view..
We started out with 4 nice servers, we're now down to 2 (and both are unstable). We've been in beta for 6+ months now, there is no area for epic lvl's to explore and be challenged with yet..most of the main dev's have been MIA for quite some time now..people who donated money early in the beta opening to help things along are no doubt mad at what their money has gotten them so far (or lack there of to be more precise)
Certain players and player groups seemingly get away with breaking the rules as they see fit, certain high lvl players are "claming" the more popular leveling areas as "their own" and driving out anybody who tries to explore or level there, ect.
There is a diff between somebody who hasnt been here more then 2 weeks complaining about what they know little about, and the peeps (myself included) who have been here since they opened beta and have seen VERY little in the way of major improvements or expansion in MONTHS. Maybe the dev's are waiting until 1.64 comes out to start major work on ns4 again, and ive heard a rumor that they are building a whole new server from sractch, so maybe thats holding things up a bit. Nobody knows the truth or reasons why, we havnt been told. So i think a little voicing of frustration with a mod / community people OBVIOUSLY care for can be tolerated, no?
We started out with 4 nice servers, we're now down to 2 (and both are unstable). We've been in beta for 6+ months now, there is no area for epic lvl's to explore and be challenged with yet..most of the main dev's have been MIA for quite some time now..people who donated money early in the beta opening to help things along are no doubt mad at what their money has gotten them so far (or lack there of to be more precise)
Certain players and player groups seemingly get away with breaking the rules as they see fit, certain high lvl players are "claming" the more popular leveling areas as "their own" and driving out anybody who tries to explore or level there, ect.
There is a diff between somebody who hasnt been here more then 2 weeks complaining about what they know little about, and the peeps (myself included) who have been here since they opened beta and have seen VERY little in the way of major improvements or expansion in MONTHS. Maybe the dev's are waiting until 1.64 comes out to start major work on ns4 again, and ive heard a rumor that they are building a whole new server from sractch, so maybe thats holding things up a bit. Nobody knows the truth or reasons why, we havnt been told. So i think a little voicing of frustration with a mod / community people OBVIOUSLY care for can be tolerated, no?
Face it NS 4 has tanked. It should be scratched. There werent that many Devs for a mod of this size with 4 servers. I know about 15 DM's are gone. The old players are gone. The fews Devs that remain, some a Missing, and have not been heard from for weeks or even months. They started work on NS 3.5. Why? The $ donationed was wasted it looks like. DD does not trust many to help him not that I blame him for that, thanks to a certain few that will remain nameless. Most importantly, what is fun about it? I know its beta, but really what is fun about it? Poor noobs get screwed. DM/Staff plays favorites which is horrible. Good thing wasted if you ask me. I mean they have been working on this for what 2 years+? Even with RL stuff 2 years is a long time, to get only this far. Exspecially with all the unnecessary stuff like nerfing things all to hell, just finish it, then tweak, tweaking as you go slows things way down.
DM Devlin the Nightwalker
of NS 3 South
of NS 3 South
Look, allot of us are TRYING to keep some measure of faith that ns4 hasnt been abandoned as a viable community. And if it has, why keep the 2 servers up? it DOES cost money to have them hosted / run, ya know.
However, the lack of dev feedback (besides lokey) IS extreamly discouraging. As is the lack of progress for the past 4-5 months. A cple MINOR bugs fixed, one major one (and its even a recent one, the aven respawn bug) and areas shuffed around servers as they crashed.
Even with the "Real life hit" excuse, it takes what...2, 3 MINUTES to make a post saying "yeah i know ive been gone a while, dont worry we're still planning on getting ns4 done. I SHOULD be back around -x- date". We havnt heard a thing from DD recently except about his job promo. Nothing from Joran in months, nothing from Nerdlor, Pros, RadPro, DD, or Adut. And 2 of the listed Dev's havnt made a SINGLE post in the forums at all
Even in this half way finished, cramped and buggy beta, it still manages to be fun and ill continue to play it until i find something better or we're told (by DD, which i would consider the last word on the subject) that the NS4 project HAS been tossed, and they are just waiting for a contract or some such to expire before they take the 2 remaining servers offline.
However, the lack of dev feedback (besides lokey) IS extreamly discouraging. As is the lack of progress for the past 4-5 months. A cple MINOR bugs fixed, one major one (and its even a recent one, the aven respawn bug) and areas shuffed around servers as they crashed.
Even with the "Real life hit" excuse, it takes what...2, 3 MINUTES to make a post saying "yeah i know ive been gone a while, dont worry we're still planning on getting ns4 done. I SHOULD be back around -x- date". We havnt heard a thing from DD recently except about his job promo. Nothing from Joran in months, nothing from Nerdlor, Pros, RadPro, DD, or Adut. And 2 of the listed Dev's havnt made a SINGLE post in the forums at all
Even in this half way finished, cramped and buggy beta, it still manages to be fun and ill continue to play it until i find something better or we're told (by DD, which i would consider the last word on the subject) that the NS4 project HAS been tossed, and they are just waiting for a contract or some such to expire before they take the 2 remaining servers offline.
Ive been here all along. Joran has been mai which almost ceased ns4 development.
We have hire 3 new devs to help get back on track, and we are working with Nerdlor for a solution to the hardware.
NS3.5 was put up to give the ns3 players something new to play with and resources were not pulled from ns4 development.
I few new donations helped put the 3.5 servers up, which if need be can be converted to ns4 servers down the road.
This is a free project and the donations for parts have slowed to a crawl.
But we arnt going anywhere, and as long as we have players we will try and continue work on the game.
We have hire 3 new devs to help get back on track, and we are working with Nerdlor for a solution to the hardware.
NS3.5 was put up to give the ns3 players something new to play with and resources were not pulled from ns4 development.
I few new donations helped put the 3.5 servers up, which if need be can be converted to ns4 servers down the road.
This is a free project and the donations for parts have slowed to a crawl.
But we arnt going anywhere, and as long as we have players we will try and continue work on the game.
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BitemeAgain
- Noob
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 9:04 am
The funny thing is I got banned from the NS3 forums for saying all these things were going to happen.....
I would assume I will now get banned for saying I told you so....
Frankly, you can't force a square peg into a round hole. NS4 is basically a creation that did not keep its NS3 player base in mind during its creation. Sometimes sticking to the basics of what makes NWN fun is better then trying to rewrite a program to do things it just doesn't do that well.
What does it tell you when developers are leaving a project they have worked on for two years? The ship is sinking or by the time it actually is something to play we will have Dragon Age or NWN2 to play.
I admire DD and company for what they wanted to do, but frankly I think their eyes are bigger then their stomach (or so to speak) in what they tried to do.
Bottom line: If you don't have the resources/time to do something then don't set expectations of a community to be this high.
Counting down till this post is removed because it is to honest.
I would assume I will now get banned for saying I told you so....
Frankly, you can't force a square peg into a round hole. NS4 is basically a creation that did not keep its NS3 player base in mind during its creation. Sometimes sticking to the basics of what makes NWN fun is better then trying to rewrite a program to do things it just doesn't do that well.
What does it tell you when developers are leaving a project they have worked on for two years? The ship is sinking or by the time it actually is something to play we will have Dragon Age or NWN2 to play.
I admire DD and company for what they wanted to do, but frankly I think their eyes are bigger then their stomach (or so to speak) in what they tried to do.
Bottom line: If you don't have the resources/time to do something then don't set expectations of a community to be this high.
Counting down till this post is removed because it is to honest.
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OctavianBear
- Noob
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Mon Jul 26, 2004 4:39 am
I can understand that people are frustrated and I have nothing against freedom of expression. However, I agree with MaxOverdrive; this is in beta. So if you want to help test the beta, then stay and help test the beta. If you find it overwhelmingly frustrating and can't cope with it, then leave for a while and hopefully come back later. If you must vent your spleen then do so, but please keep in mind that everyone involved is doing this in their free time.
I mean come on, this is really pretty damn good for a beta. OK, so it's not so playable once you go epic, but it's still pretty good! Start another char and try another faction. Or *gasp* spend a little time RPing instead of just hacking & slashing, that might improve playability too.
I mean come on, this is really pretty damn good for a beta. OK, so it's not so playable once you go epic, but it's still pretty good! Start another char and try another faction. Or *gasp* spend a little time RPing instead of just hacking & slashing, that might improve playability too.
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sep caldessian
- Wheres the donation box?
- Posts: 190
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:48 am
people are just tired of this beta, with seemingly no forward progress.
Which is the reason I scratched my head at this open beta idea. Releasing betas works well for application software. It's actually the biggest thing that drives open/free application projects, release early, release often. I can see why the devs havent followed the release often in this case. To release little bits and peices as they're developed would make the game very predictable and boring to all of us beta testers. What fun is the final release when you know 80% of the game? This is why i thought the open beta was a bad idea. Sure it's great to have people actively testing, but i think it was too early. Now if DD and co already have plans to get around this, props to them, hope it works out.
For those getting disgruntled about devs 'leaving', put yourself in their shoes for a second. You've spend 1, 2 maybe close to 3 years now working on a project where the only benefit is the great creation you have to unfold. You only reep the rewards of this when you get the final release out. Wouldnt you want a break? I've seen plenty of projects like this where devs are basically volunteers, you dont really keep the same people from beginning to end, you may lose some, but as you do you usually get fresh minds in the ranks. This is a good thing not a bad thing. Sure the new guys gotta learn what's going on with everything, but it also brings in fresh ideas. 10 heads are better than 2.
To those getting bored, like was said above, try out the other factions, or go rp a bit. Its not hard to rp w/o going the road of hardcore rules. If rp isnt your thing, try a new faction, test out the areas, mess around with different builds. But most of all you do need patience, if you find yourself constantly losing patience, than i would say NS 4 isnt for you yet. There's no harm in taking a break for a month, or two even.
Most of all, dont lose faith. It's probably the biggest thing that crushes projects. To the DD and co, might help to try and renew some faith. I know this is beta, but would it hurt to have a few, even a couple of DMs throwing some variety into the mix? There's still lots to go into this mod, but there's definetly enough here now to work with. There must be a few DMs willing to interact a bit more. From the complaints ive seen, the biggest thing people want is a bit more interaction. To know that someone in the ranks actually wants to be part of this too. For a quick example, there was a PvP tourney not long ago, seemed to give a few people something to do for awhile, and a DM made a presence to help with the event. Can we see some more DMs pokin their nose in like this? Even once a week would be nice.
Well, there's my coppers on the issue.