NPC balance idea?

Wakboth · Post by **Wakboth** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 11:27 pm

Don't know if there's a thread to discuss this already. If so I applogize.

I've only been playing around on NS4 for a few weeks, so my exposure to different areas is kinda limited. However, there was one particular issue I've run into with on of my new characters that prompted this post.

Specifically, I'm talking about the NPC levels in the area around the drow city of Menzo, and from the perspective of a newish player to this mod.

There seems to be a less then even level distribution in the immediate area around the city. Basically, there are three directions you can go: The house tunnels, the hidden tunnel, or the legion tunnels (out the front door). In all three areas, the NPCs are all pretty much 1st and 2nd level mobs (beetles, rats, bats, molemen, and the occasional hound and such).

In all three directions, after working through those guys, you run smack into mobs that due to level and type are dramatically tougher. Basically, I got my drow to level 4 and realized that I had a choice between killing easy/wimpy mobs for hours and hours (boring as heck), or trying to move further and gettng stomped pretty much wherever I went. The orcs are too numerous and tough to handle. The goblins in the chasm, while doable are still a bit tough, and the random mobs in Redhorn pass can be *way* too difficult at that level.

You're probably thinking: "Ah! Well. You should group up." Yeah. I agree. However, only once so far have I even found someone else in my level range in the area. I kinda see the levels from 1-5 as the "newbie" levels, where you're pretty much going to hunt in the immediate area around your home city before moving out into the broad world. With my first character (a dwarf in RK), I had *zero* problems finding progressively tougher mobs to fight from levels one to 5, eventually leading me out to Avendale and broader hunting grounds (and more PC interaction!). With my drow, I'm finding it much more difficult. Part of that is the subrace penalty, but a huge amount is the lack of reasonably placed mobs in the 3-4 range in the area. Going from level 1-2 mobs that are placed sporadicaly in tunnels to level 3-5 mobs that are clumped in groups immediately beyond, especially when combined with the level/gear restrictions in the game (meaning that I can't quite get that next upgrade yet that might allow me to manage the tougher mobs), is making this level feel like a brick wall.

Sure. It's a minor issue. I can certainly work through it (and will). I just wanted to bring it to the Devs attention as a possible balance tweak to look at down the line. Much of the difficulty could be reduced simply by replacing one of the three areas with slightly higher level mobs that are still less "social" in nature. Maybe make some of the mobs range from 2-3 in one or two of the tunnel zones, just to make the level transition a bit more smooth.

IcemanXV · Post by **IcemanXV** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 11:47 pm

That is the pain of being drow, my friend. When at level 4, the enemies around menzoduran will give you bad xp because you're effectively a level 7. A regular level 4 would have no problem leveling up there until level 6 or so, when they could go out and kill the orcs without too much problem. Other non ECL races can level 3 more times in the areas you can. And quite frankly, those 3 levels give them the edge.

I also don't think the orcs near menzo are THAT numerous. I fought them as a level 4-5 myself.

Quiett · Post by **Quiett** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 9:27 am

I have to agree with WakBoth here. It's not just playing a drow that is slowing him down. I have the same problem playing a regular human trying to get to lvl 5. Granted it's easier than doing it with a drow, but still it is quite difficult for me (unless I'm a cleric of course)

You can go from killing beetles to Kobolds, which the archers do like 15 damage, and the illusionists just wreck you, or you can try your hand in the crypt with elite skeletons and warrior zombies, or perhaps Driders and Ettercaps are your fancy, or better than that, go stright to gnolls.

(how was that for a run-on sentance

)

After playing in all 7 factions, SL is the hardest by far to go from lvl 4 to lvl 5.

LadyCheron · Post by **LadyCheron** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:08 pm

Thanks! That's the kind of feedback needed to help balance the starting areas, and it fits in with my own observations. I think we need a couple more maps that aren't on the "main road" to anywhere, populated by CR 3-5 mobs. And something besides rats and bugs - one gets tired of them after a while!

IcemanXV · Post by **IcemanXV** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 1:24 pm

Quiett wrote:I have to agree with WakBoth here. It's not just playing a drow that is slowing him down. I have the same problem playing a regular human trying to get to lvl 5. Granted it's easier than doing it with a drow, but still it is quite difficult for me (unless I'm a cleric of course)

You can go from killing beetles to Kobolds, which the archers do like 15 damage, and the illusionists just wreck you, or you can try your hand in the crypt with elite skeletons and warrior zombies, or perhaps Driders and Ettercaps are your fancy, or better than that, go stright to gnolls.

(how was that for a run-on sentance )

After playing in all 7 factions, SL is the hardest by far to go from lvl 4 to lvl 5.

I always start the first 5 levels fighting beetles, cave hounds, and mole men.

The last one might be slower, but it's not too terrible. Once you get to level 5, your gear gets stronger and will allow you to handle the kobolds/orcs better.

Quiett · Post by **Quiett** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 8:36 am

IcemanXV:

I always start the first 5 levels fighting beetles, cave hounds, and mole men.

The last one might be slower, but it's not too terrible. Once you get to level 5, your gear gets stronger and will allow you to handle the kobolds/orcs better.

I agree with you here, but the point we were trying to make was that in the other factions, there are more enemies you can fight in the lvl 3-5 range that don't require the lvl 5 gear.

Heron · Post by **Heron** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 11:57 am

I agree, I started playing in SL and thought it was simply the speed of the mod. However, now that I am trying out a Circle character I am finding it incredibly more entertaining.

I think the low level areas around the underdark should be slightly harder (than the other factions) to make up for the racial modifiers (easy should be cr 3 & 4 and such). Perhaps some escaped human (or better yet dwarven) slaves, Drow rebels, and such…

Shasz · Post by **Shasz** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 1:41 pm

The Shadow Legion seems to have a huge number of 1-3 level beetle zones compared to others I've played too. Perhaps the 2nd and third screens of beetles could be where the tougher critters of CR 3 - 5 hang out.