Pally abilities

[Tsavong]

I have a pure pally all be it not the same build as yours and I have no complaints part of it comes from getting the hang of when it is best to use your tokens to be the most effective.

[mining]

Pure fighter slinger or stunner is not the first thing that comes to my mind to fight pure paladin mining... Both of those builds are not so good, which is why almost no one builds them. And you know that , so I don't understand why you're even mentioning those builds in the first place. I mean really.. slinger fighter.. You serious?

You can make a stunning fighter or a dex based fighter that can use a sling / get high 80s AC in IE in SL.

I didn't say slinger fighter. I said dex based fighter that can use a sling. Because 77 AC self buffed before IE is horribly bad, isn't it, and being able to apply +20 damage on top of a weapons normal damage doesn't help out a dexxer.

And stunning fighters are certainly not terrible. AC/AB doesn't even matter, because DC 61 stunning fist and 109 odd discipline doesn't leave much room to remain alive. Because he isn't dex based, you'll win the initiative check and get 2 stun attempts before he gets a single smite attempt.

[Twiggy]

Not saying give haste...but give something so i can slow other people down...or not even that...improve the distance of the pally mord ability.

haste isn't the problem...didn't pally's have an ability like fighters kd token? where veryone bowed in your presence? i heard it was crazy powerful...but it sounds an awful lot like the fighter kd token..which is still around....

instead of basing it on disc like a fighters make it on concentration or something.

and neil, I am not all of TC/NC. I am one person. And what I do, and what other people do are completely different.

Linux didn't see that, nvm then should change the in game description then

Tsavang, REALLY the only complaint i have is people running around in circles away from me...and me not having anyway of putting them down..

Also linux, Barbs have a fear aura they can use to chase people down with, fighter have a kd token....pally's have extended might and shield, a once per rest res token, a mass res token that kills you, a one shot 50/50 chance to strip pure casters, a one shot limited regen and 15 percent casting failure ring. .....i'll trade those for a "get over here" button

[mining]

I wouldn't. Pure Paladins are arguably the most amazing melee tank in the game, at the cost of no spot, reliance on divine feats, and other short term thingies.

Their level 40 power used to do that, but they're already strong enough. Used to get double divine might damage too.

[Tsavong]

The pure Paladin abilities seem by design more defensive than say a fighter or a barb which is why they don't have a KD token or haste as that would be too much and you can get haste from a pot or a nice caster.

Twigie people running around in circles away from you is going to be a problem for most builds unless you can grab a ranged weapon to bring them down when they are nice and flat footed running away from you.

Mining I would not go that far they are nice and good fun but not the best melee tank you can get more AC or more DI/DR from other builds.

[mining]

But not more of both

[neil420]

I will give you that i cant think of you running and healing . Spamming that crazy regen thing maybe but not healing lol.

[mining]

I will give you that i cant think of you running and healing . Spamming that crazy regen thing maybe but not healing lol.

1) Equip Marut Rings.
2) ???
3) Enjoy regen comparable to that of pure paladin .

[Twiggy]

mining it just seems like you are boosting up pally's because you want to....

Pally's are nice, don't get me wrong. and vs an evil toon are virtually unstoppable. But they are not the be all and end all of melee builds.

Pure Pally's get one regen thing, and that lasts for maybe 3 minutes then fades. idk what you mean by spamming regen neil. Or your reference to pure pally regen mining

what is your list about mining?

Pally's as a tank? no way, dwd's are far better melee tanks. You can make a dwd that has the same or better ab and damage with far better dr. Don't need ac to be a tank. need healing ability and DR. Also if you make them with good ac IE adding cha so their shield is higher, you reduce ab. DWD has a crapton of health, DR out the wazzoo, and can damage you 15 fire damage every hit, without hitting you.

tsavaong yeah i was already thinking of remaking capt as a dexer to be able to shoot them as they are running away. as well as getting haste..although balancing dex and cha will be a little bit of a challenge.

[mining]

I'm not boosting pallys up because I want to, I'm saying that pure paladins enjoy a nice position of having great AB, good AC, good DI, good DR, good damage.

Pure Pally Regen = Regen Aura you're talking about.

And yes, DWDs are better... But you can tank with AC and DI/HP. Paladin enjoys half a DWD's DI/DR and 2/3 - 3/4 their HP - but they make up for it in more AB, damage and AC. The idea is that its a potent tank, albeit not the best - it doesn't need help surviving.

[Twiggy]

what ab are you talking about? and what DI / DR? we get the same amount of DR/DI that anyone with good gear gets. Plus 30 percent immunity max if you 40 CHA, and DR of 5 damage . but if you have that high cha you sacrifice ab. my pally has about 54 ab self buffed with weapon feats. he can get to 61 with a pdk and bard.

dwd's have DR of around 30 damage plus reg gear stuff.

only thing pally's trump dwd's in, is damage, and that's only if you're evil and you can smite them.

the regen aura is nice in a pinch. it get's up to around 10 regen i think. The durations i 3 minutes about ( which is not that long) and you can't spam it, unless you have multiple pally's i guess. But this is assuming you are fighting with other people.

Also when people tell stats of their toons, only tell what you can get by yourself, not what you can get buffed by other people..it get's confusing.

[Twiggy]

I wouldn't. Pure Paladins are arguably the most amazing melee tank in the game.

I'm not boosting pallys up because I want to................
The idea is that its a potent tank, albeit not the best - it doesn't need help surviving.

My point^. You are saying pally's are awesome! no need to change them! They kick [censored]. But in reality they are good, but improvement doesn't hurt.

[cRaZy8or5e]

Twig you seem to be trying to make the argument that paladins aren't very good and that they need MORE abilities in addition to what they have already.

Mining is explaining to you how and why he disagrees. I think Mining is correct, paladins are extremely powerful under the right circumstances.

They used to be ridiculously so, especially with their timestopping horses. Too bad those created so many problems because then having haste wasn't an issue anymore. You'd still get gunned down and slowed by any mage worth his salt or any monk/AA but that's beside the point. The point is that a strength based pure melee paladin is just not built to fight ranged combatants. You're bringing a door ram to a sniper fight. Build a dex based or a hybrid dex/str pally if you want to be able to have a chance against those sort of characters, and still bank on using your heal spells. Otherwise find a way to use terrain to your advantage, ie don't stand out in the open, get behind a door, something that forces them to come closer to you, or try and get them to chase you through a transition and catch them on the other side Anything is better than playing moving target at range for them.

[cRaZy8or5e]

My point^. You are saying pally's are awesome! no need to change them! They kick [censored]. But in reality they are good, but improvement doesn't hurt.

Any more improvement would in actuality hurt as it would make them overpowered in my opinion.

[Twiggy]

Initially I really just wanted the mord thing's distance increased. And then I was arguing about how they are nice but not the beast bombshell everyone is talking about.

adding distance to the mord's spell wouldn't hurt.

Fighters get both haste and a powerful KD token, not to mention +20 to their ab for a limited time, immunity to fear, paralysis, added speed, added regen, added discipline, FOM ability, and have a faster base movement speed. All of this ties into the main fighter ability scores of str and con

Barbarians get added ability of their rage, which includes Fearing (not sure how useful it is, but since noone is complaining I assume it is mediocre enough to be useful, yet sucky enough not to tick people off) a minor boost to DI, Regen, and health boosts.

A paladin get's +4 ab maxed (if you have 50 CHA), 45 percent immunity to damage (if you have 50 CHA), a few different res abilities, a max of 10 regen for 30 rounds (if you have 50 CHA), double duration on might and shield, immunity to kd, ability decrease, poison, mind affecting spells, 5 damage reduction, immunity to spells 6 and below, see invis and added spot for 20 rounds max (with 50 CHA)

The fighter get's everything and loses no ab, ac, or damage in just dooing what he does and get's haste and a powerful kd token

barbarians....well idk what to say about them (take that as it is, i don't know their capabilites)

and Pally's get some amazing abilities but at the cost of ab which means ability to hit people. if you go to 50 cha you will need to sacrifice ab and feats. without that much cha those abilites last for a much shorter duration, are far less potent and don't do as much. WHich means going against any high ac nuetral toon you will die because you cannot hit them.

the comparison is just to show that pally bonuses are nice on the surface but to get the full capablity you have sacrifice ab (str and or DEX) and you will be forced to only fight evil toons.

If that is your intention then nvm


I AM NOT SAYING PALLY'S SUCK. just that their abilities couldn't hurt to be improved. and by abilities i mean adding distance to the mords and giving a kdesque token