Tired of Faction Loss

[Mental]

Today I lost my faction again, this is like the 6th time or more, I lost count. I had my faction restored all other times, but this is gettin real frustrating. I cant even defend with the spells i wanna use thats most effective to me. I use ice storm, and when a guard is near or trying to attack the raider I hit them with ice storm and they start attacking me. There are other spells that cause this like vine mine hamper movement, seering light, ect.... . Is there anyway to fix this very annoying problem?? I am just getting tired of this happening to me, but its not only myself, it is other players as well. I hope the devs can help with this problem.

[Bargeld]

There are a few key PvP AoE spells that work much better (Neg nrg burst off the top of my head). Sunbeam is a good distraction for a few rounds.

If you can get a good bigsby off, you will be much happier than the 78 damage that ice storm does to a sneaker who can either outrun the spell or chug a pot after 4 of them.

Or take spell focus to help your spot buffs that you cast on a solar

This all comes from the other side of the fence, from a hider's point of view... honestly, there are very few damage inducing AoE spells that will do much damage to a sneaky type, as they have reflexes thru the roof and, at best, will take 1/2 damage for a failed save. I'd love to see a quickened ice storm specialist raining destruction down on Judiciary square just as much as you! But, the citizens of NS city won't be so happy.

[Mental]

I use neg burst, but that wont kill em. My ice storm can do lotsa damage in a short time because i am auto quickened. It just doesnt make sense why other spells dont affect the guards like storm of vengance. I think spells like ice storm and seering light, also vinemine hamper movement should be made non affected to the city guards. My cleric usesd a bow, but when i lose sight of the sd, i find spells like ice storm works well when they are HIPSing.

[Lorkar]

Vine Mine and Ice Storm have never been even party friendly (I am not even sure if Ice Storm is even caster friendly), so I can see why they are not NPC friendly. Personally I believe that any AoE spell should not be anything but caster friendly. And as long as all factions share the same risks then I don't see why anything should be changed.

[frogofpeace]

Is there any way to make the selectivity of AOE spells scale with level, like you guys did with hellball? Frankly, I like non-party friendly AOE spells: casters are generally not underpowered (read: they are generally overpowered, but trying to not open myself to flames [*insert angel emoticon here*]) and making them watch out for allies or innocent bystanders requires a little skill and strategy, rather than just tapping a hotkey for a saveless spell repeatedly.

That said, given the context of the relic game, seems a little unfair they get permanently (wo DM intervention) penalized by their faction - maybe there's a way they can do penance. Dropping a ton of ice spears on a crowded street shouldn't be without penalty - after all, Spiderman gets blamed for bad stuff that happens when he's do-gooding ) 50 prayers at the altar of Mask? Die to the mob, who are then sated by vengeance?

[Blystos Re]

This Is Aetheria.

No one Ever Really Dies here, how can you expect a mob to be sated by one death when it's so impermanent?



(<------ Returns to his wine binge.)

[Dalan]

Learn what spells to cast that won't harm or kill your own faction npc's, or lose your faction. It has always been this way, and will remain this way. It is part of pvp in the cities.

I've had it with players asking for faction restore, just to turn around and see you sling spells for maximum effect pvp with no thought for the consequences for harming/killing your own npc's.

*throws mug of ale against the wall and pulls out faction loss wand*

[Nyeleni]

Agreed. Especially traitors (in case you are Vindur, if not, my apologies) shouldn't complain .

[Metis]

This is for new people any veterans should know this and if you are in a guild I would expect someone could have told you this if you asked.

The benefits of your faction a privalige not a right. If you start killing residents don't be surprised when they don't want you around anymore.

For melee types, I can be sympathetic a little when your in a big group and accidently knock down a guard instead of your intended target so what should you do? Well I would run out that guy is going to mad at you now so get out of there let him cool down (ie let it respawn) then he will forgive you, stay and kill him then what else can you expect you wont be to popular anymore.

For the all powerful casters, still learning the spell changes? You didn't realize that spell would hurt a guard? Whats the answer?
A. Just kill him off and any others that are around
B. Same as a fighter

I have seen someone in every faction hurt their guards but continue to cast the same spell over and over then wonder why the guards dont like them, even to my amazement getting their faction fixed and doing it again.

Now, your kind of new and still learning the ropes and you didn't realize what you did wrong ask your God(des) for help, heres some tips, "dm on?" "fix my faction" will be met in silence, you might get lucky but dont count on it, try some kind of prayer or at least something, you don't to be super RP player heck its a little bit of effort to at least try, if you care about your faction it should be worth it to you.

For those of you that don't know, your faction has a level so one accidental hit or spell will not ruin your faction but it will start bringing it down, it is intentional to forgive the few accidents, so to loose your faction status you would have to continuosly perform hostile actions.

The price of forgiveness, this will vary greatly depending on your actions, casting 7 ice storms that keep hitting your ally and never stopping what do you think will happen. I have fixed countless factions for people from all over some I required gold, others specific items, and others to perform specific task each will be very different depending on new player, severity, and honest mistake or just didn't care. There are some I will not fix it, get your faction restored to do it again the next day, once I saw a good one someone was "testing" the dc of their spells, etc this desicion is based greatly on current and previous actions. We do not have hard rules for the staff so I speak for myself. You may get lucky but the general consus is if you don't care about your faction relationship why should we.

Your guards are there to help you so if that means being extra careful who you hit or not using some spells, so be it, that is the price of having a safe home.

From my previous post, note the bold part, even if you were being careful but still hit a guard you are obviously making no effort to get away from the situation.

[DM_Kim]

Today I lost my faction again, this is like the 6th time or more, I lost count. I had my faction restored all other times, but this is gettin real frustrating. I cant even defend with the spells i wanna use thats most effective to me. I use ice storm, and when a guard is near or trying to attack the raider I hit them with ice storm and they start attacking me. There are other spells that cause this like vine mine hamper movement, seering light, ect.... . Is there anyway to fix this very annoying problem?? I am just getting tired of this happening to me, but its not only myself, it is other players as well. I hope the devs can help with this problem.

The 6th time or more??? Amazing that someone still "fixed" your faction after the second time. I have known players to lose their faction for a second time and they had to remain outcast for a long while before a quest or task was granted them to earn back their faction. If one was ever granted.

The first time a caster loses their faction by using an unfriendly spell can be expected as part of the learning curve. After that, as a caster, you have to educate yourself as to what spells are friendly and which ones aren't. It's all on you.

If you insist on using unfriendly spells then learn tactics and timing so your in the clear to use them around NPC's. If not, losing your faction is the price you pay.

[Celorn]

Today I lost my faction again, this is like the 6th time or more, I lost count. I had my faction restored all other times, but this is gettin real frustrating. I cant even defend with the spells i wanna use thats most effective to me. I use ice storm, and when a guard is near or trying to attack the raider I hit them with ice storm and they start attacking me. There are other spells that cause this like vine mine hamper movement, seering light, ect.... . Is there anyway to fix this very annoying problem?? I am just getting tired of this happening to me, but its not only myself, it is other players as well. I hope the devs can help with this problem.

The 6th time or more??? Amazing that someone still "fixed" your faction after the second time. I have known players to lose their faction for a second time and they had to remain outcast for a long while before a quest or task was granted them to earn back their faction. If one was ever granted.

The first time a caster loses their faction by using an unfriendly spell can be expected as part of the learning curve. After that, as a caster, you have to educate yourself as to what spells are friendly and which ones aren't. It's all on you.

If you insist on using unfriendly spells then learn tactics and timing so your in the clear to use them around NPC's. If not, losing your faction is the price you pay.

This is all very strange.

Here you have a problem that occurs because of factions and BIOWARE engine bugs in the Party-protected setting, and you have a 2 second fix for this problem via a script activated by a DM...

In other cases, the long-term solution is to make an AUTOMATED way of fixing an issue like this.

So WHY can this not get scripted??? Why not simply make a statue in each faction city in the temple that costs, say around 1 million gold to use - you agree to pay the $, it takes it, then gives your faction back with a glorious effect. I'm sure pup or bink could whip this sorta thing up while sipping their morning coffee...

The only player-based work-around solution I can see is: Make a enemy faction toon, and use it to clear out NPCs, then switch to your proper faction toon to defend... The problem here is that someone is gonna cry foul if someone relogs this 'other faction' toon and somehow gets involved in pvp with the raiders. But this is not a great solution for the relic room itself since it would be stupid to clear out your own NPC defenders ;P.

So PLEASE oh mighty DEVs, when you have a minute could you consider creating such a nice device - it will benefit NS4 for many years to come when NS4 development has ceased, and the server(s) are in auto-pilot mode.

[Metis]

Going to disagree with you,

Making it a 1 mill gold just furthers the power, for a lot of players its nothing for many its not possible to get for a very long time and I dont think its fair that route while some players have insane amount of gold they dont have to worry and others still have to be careful

I dont see why spells that are not party friendly should be npc friendly, if your group is fighting and you start pummeling them with maxed ice storms (doom, etc ,etc) you are going to hurt them they wont attack you, or maybe they will, so why should a npc just sit there and take it without reaction?

I really dont understand why this is so bad, so you have to use a little strategy to defend? The big thing is if you hit a guard you dont loose your faction, see my post above your faction starts as 100 every hit lowers it and frankly, sorry but to loose your faction its not the 1 time oops its constant.

Besides all that if it happens I tend to offer a way back (although 6 times is way out there, you got very lucky someone just kept fixing it) what a small rp is going to kill you? Even then a lot didnt and I gave small quests or demands but I fix your faction and you run outside and loose it again that doesnt seem right it should be fixable that quick and easy.

I will say I think, think mind you not sure, there may be a couple spells party friendly but hurts a npc, almost all shifter abilities are this way, so to me and I know it sounds mean but to bad, out of the entire arsenal of a caster the 2-3 spells they cant use means they cant defend effectively?

One last note, I have seen countless times a player hurts a guard, by mistake or on purpose, wastes maybe 5 seconds to avoid killing him and doesnt loose their faction

My view on it and btw yes the script can be put in place but if it was ever brought up I would give a firm NO vote

[Nognog]

sometimes ns4 is too old, prehistoric. Have you ever seen other servers? Take example.
With a wizard, well it's easy, cast horrids, cast wail, cast igms, firebrand. But now think about spellcasting clerics for a moment, Implode? Ok, rarely hits guards, (but is possible) Storm of vengeance? no, but it's really an offensive spell? not doing much damage... Maxed blade barrier, maxed ice storm hammer of the gods, these are the cleric spells, and In all the servers I play are party friendly, if isn't so nobody will use spellcasting clerics.

[burrahobbit]

Some guards are so weak that one ill placed scyth swing will kill them. I have lost the ability to defend in TC with 2 of my chars because of 2 bad kd swings. If one mil isnt enough, make it 10. At lest we will have the ability, although very time consuming, of fixing the problem ourselves.

[DM_Kim]

This discussion has been had several times in the past all with the same conclusion: You learn what is safe to use and what is not. Lose your faction and toss you PC's soul on the grill and offer it to the gods and pray that they help you regain it. Some gods may fix you right up, some may require an item of gold or something else of value, some may have you complete a quest. The gods are and always will be your only option of gaining your faction back.

That's the way it has been for the longest time. It is not because spells can't be changed or settings can't be adjusted, it's because that is the way of life in Aetheria.

Learn the ways of Aetheria, and as stated: One's Faction is a Privilege Not a Right. It should be protected, guarded and great care should be taken in order not to lose it.