rangers in SL when we restrict it to elf only...yeah...how bout that?
rangers in MA? when i'm dead.
its not like SL and MA have really huge restrictions on builds, there are a couple factions worse off.
Faction restricted class
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Amoenotep
- Lord DM Supreme
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Re: Faction restricted class
yeah..but they have to be dwarves so thats like the worst ever.
rangers in SL when we restrict it to elf only...yeah...how bout that?
rangers in MA? when i'm dead.
its not like SL and MA have really huge restrictions on builds, there are a couple factions worse off.
rangers in SL when we restrict it to elf only...yeah...how bout that?
rangers in MA? when i'm dead.
its not like SL and MA have really huge restrictions on builds, there are a couple factions worse off.
Re: Faction restricted class
SL and MA don't like hippies. No druids, no rangers.
Re: Faction restricted class
Disastro, when I said base melee I meant the 1 for 1 AB pre-epic progression not 3/4.
Amoenotep, I have zero problems with Shadow Legion being Elf only. Bring it on. And using the the dwarf analogy doesn't really work now does it? And if MA can't have Rangers then a uniform policy needs to be implemented as far as divine classes go, clerics should be pulled. And to be really fair about it all Drow should be Shadow Legion only, Duergar should be Ragnars Kin only.
As a matter of fact each faction should have a faction specific race.
Shadow Legion-Drow
Ragnars Kin-Duergar
Ancient Ones-Lizard Men
Northern Coalition-Aasimar
The Circle-a pixie/nymph/treeant type race
Mystral Ascendancy-Illithids or some other arcane race.
Last Alliance-Anything not already taken
Amoenotep, I have zero problems with Shadow Legion being Elf only. Bring it on. And using the the dwarf analogy doesn't really work now does it? And if MA can't have Rangers then a uniform policy needs to be implemented as far as divine classes go, clerics should be pulled. And to be really fair about it all Drow should be Shadow Legion only, Duergar should be Ragnars Kin only.
As a matter of fact each faction should have a faction specific race.
Shadow Legion-Drow
Ragnars Kin-Duergar
Ancient Ones-Lizard Men
Northern Coalition-Aasimar
The Circle-a pixie/nymph/treeant type race
Mystral Ascendancy-Illithids or some other arcane race.
Last Alliance-Anything not already taken
He who exercises no forethought but makes light
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
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Amoenotep
- Lord DM Supreme
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- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:09 pm
- Location: in the mists of eternity
Re: Faction restricted class
MA will never get rangers. they aren't explorers, they are magicians and thieves. its the founding principles of the city and how they run theirselves. the only reason they are so exiled from the rest of aetheria is the fact they built their city out there. they didn't build out there so they could have rangers to explore the land...thats why they can scry
Re: Faction restricted class
OK, while I get what you are saying and why you are saying it the fact remains that Shadow Legion and the Mystral Ascendancy do not have access to a base melee class with spot.
And that fact is what puts both factions at a severe disadvantage in the detection department.
Its like Northern Coalition not having access to a class with tumble. No they don't have rogue but they have access to monk and bard. And truthfully I don't see why Northern Coalition does not have rogues.
Is there another solution to either or both factions having access to a base melee class with spot? I don't see one since Ranger is THE only base melee with it. I would be happy to hear reasonable alternatives.
Is there a way to give PC's the spot skill with a job like token? Something that could be paid for with XP and gold maybe. Figure 1,000 XP and 10,000 gold per point.
And that fact is what puts both factions at a severe disadvantage in the detection department.
Its like Northern Coalition not having access to a class with tumble. No they don't have rogue but they have access to monk and bard. And truthfully I don't see why Northern Coalition does not have rogues.
Is there another solution to either or both factions having access to a base melee class with spot? I don't see one since Ranger is THE only base melee with it. I would be happy to hear reasonable alternatives.
Is there a way to give PC's the spot skill with a job like token? Something that could be paid for with XP and gold maybe. Figure 1,000 XP and 10,000 gold per point.
He who exercises no forethought but makes light
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
-
Amoenotep
- Lord DM Supreme
- Posts: 4717
- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:09 pm
- Location: in the mists of eternity
Re: Faction restricted class
a system like that could get exploitable really fast....i can already think of a few ways to get it done
NC doesn't have access to rogues, sorcs, or wizzy's....no pp or casting for them, also all of their chars have a specific alignment on which they can take.
TC doesn't have access to mage based casters either, so there goes the super circle wizzy in the woods.
there are 2 factions looking at the same restrictions you are from the other side of the glass.
NC doesn't have access to rogues, sorcs, or wizzy's....no pp or casting for them, also all of their chars have a specific alignment on which they can take.
TC doesn't have access to mage based casters either, so there goes the super circle wizzy in the woods.
there are 2 factions looking at the same restrictions you are from the other side of the glass.
Re: Faction restricted class
I guess I will have to accept that although I do not agree and do not see the logic behind it all.
Ragnars Kin gets Rangers and Druids but Shadow Legion doesn't. Mystral Ascendancy gets Clerics but not Rangers or Druids. Northern Coalition gets Bards and Monks but not rogues. Northern Coalition gets Bards but not Sorcs or Wizards. The Circle gets Bards but not Sorcs or Wizards.
This does not seems fair or balanced.
Amoenotep, can you see why I say what I say?
All of the above mentioned classes have a common connection, yet they are not applied equally. It doesn't make sense for a faction to get partial access to a skill or casting class but be denied access to all of the classes with either the skill or casting ability.
There needs to be a consistent application of rules,skills and classes both from faction to faction and on the server as a whole.
Meaning, if Ragnars Kin has certain base classes then Shadow Legion, which has the same conditions, should have them as well.
Ragnars Kin gets Rangers and Druids but Shadow Legion doesn't. Mystral Ascendancy gets Clerics but not Rangers or Druids. Northern Coalition gets Bards and Monks but not rogues. Northern Coalition gets Bards but not Sorcs or Wizards. The Circle gets Bards but not Sorcs or Wizards.
This does not seems fair or balanced.
Amoenotep, can you see why I say what I say?
All of the above mentioned classes have a common connection, yet they are not applied equally. It doesn't make sense for a faction to get partial access to a skill or casting class but be denied access to all of the classes with either the skill or casting ability.
There needs to be a consistent application of rules,skills and classes both from faction to faction and on the server as a whole.
Meaning, if Ragnars Kin has certain base classes then Shadow Legion, which has the same conditions, should have them as well.
He who exercises no forethought but makes light
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
Re: Faction restricted class
But they really can't scry now can they? I mean a wizard can't sit in the tower and really see what is happening in the plains. That to me is using an RP explanation in a PvP world. If you want to do that then the Mystral Ascendancy should have trip wires out there by the dragon, the boat, garagoth road and the formian tunnels to alert all within the faction that there are intruders in their realm. Since they can "scry", they should know what is happening in their lands, no?Amoenotep wrote:.......... they didn't build out there so they could have rangers to explore the land...thats why they can scry
He who exercises no forethought but makes light
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
-
Amoenotep
- Lord DM Supreme
- Posts: 4717
- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:09 pm
- Location: in the mists of eternity
Re: Faction restricted class
so....eh? a RP answer for a pvp world...ok, i get you there.
but you need to realize something, all factions don't have all the classes because they aren't all LA. the world is built on 7 opposing factions in a struggle with each other to be the top. each faction has strengths and weaknesses. to say that all factions should be the same is basically saying you want to play on ns3.5 where you can build anything you want...but you can't pvp.
read through the ns documentation of the factions, their races, and their restrictions and how they are based and some of these might become a bit more clear.
there are only 3 classes SL isn't allowed to make..druid, ranger, and paladin(besides any alignment/faction restricted PrC's). if you look at those 3 classes you can see those are all classes that are at their core linked to one another in base types/basic beliefs as a class.
but you need to realize something, all factions don't have all the classes because they aren't all LA. the world is built on 7 opposing factions in a struggle with each other to be the top. each faction has strengths and weaknesses. to say that all factions should be the same is basically saying you want to play on ns3.5 where you can build anything you want...but you can't pvp.
read through the ns documentation of the factions, their races, and their restrictions and how they are based and some of these might become a bit more clear.
there are only 3 classes SL isn't allowed to make..druid, ranger, and paladin(besides any alignment/faction restricted PrC's). if you look at those 3 classes you can see those are all classes that are at their core linked to one another in base types/basic beliefs as a class.
Re: Faction restricted class
I read the link but it still doesn't explain the disparity between Ragnars Kin and Shadow Legion, the Paladin I can see because of faction restricted alignment but neither the druid nor the ranger have an issue that would conflict with factional alignments. I understand there are strengths and weaknesses from faction to faction but Ragnars Kin and Shadow Legion are too similar in environment(and attitude to a degree, neither dwarves nor drow think highly of outsiders) to ignore, and since they both have the ability to worship deities they should have equal access to deity driven classes, alignment restrictions withstanding.
He who exercises no forethought but makes light
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
-
Amoenotep
- Lord DM Supreme
- Posts: 4717
- Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:09 pm
- Location: in the mists of eternity
Re: Faction restricted class
so...dwarves and drow should be on equal terms...well, i know some dwarves that will argue that out.
Re: Faction restricted class
Not equal terms but footing yes. As you know some dwarves that argue that point I know some Drow that would surely flay me for even bringing up the comparison.Amoenotep wrote:so...dwarves and drow should be on equal terms...well, i know some dwarves that will argue that out.
He who exercises no forethought but makes light
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
of his opponents is sure to be captured by them.
SunTzu
"God not only plays dice, he throws them in the corner where you can't see them."
-- Stephen William Hawking (b. 1942)--
Re: Faction restricted class
The rest of us did just that. Some of us even find this to be one of the best features of NS4. (just in case: I use to play SL Drow exclusively at one time for a couple of years when NS4 was in beta).Terl wrote:I guess I will have to accept that although I do not agree and do not see the logic behind it all.
This discussion has been repeated before when it was asked: Why no Wizards or Sorcerer in TC or NC and very restricted clerics.
Explanations and answers have been given to the best of ability. In the end it comes down to: This is the world that is Aetheria. This is what makes it so special. Enjoy....
Mistress Kim
dm_kim999@hotmail.com
*************************************************
Berronar Truesilver - The Revered Mother
dm_kim999@hotmail.com
*************************************************
Berronar Truesilver - The Revered Mother
Re: Faction restricted class
There is an easy solution to this. lol AO lost paladins a while back because, well i dont really know because but anyway i seem to remember people saying a Paladin did not fit with AO etc.
Well take druid and ranger out of RK they dont fit either when you think about it, and look at the points made by others above + you gave RK gnomes AND made a new wiz favored race for them, GNOME are uber)
As far as the MA and spot thing goes, there must be some way to make a spotter over there, sure you wont get 4 att, unless you are hasted but trust me you dont ALWAYS need 4 attacks around, on here its quality over quantity. Checking the book - Rogue, SD, AA and Wpn Master get spot and You are allowed bard over there to boost that - one build comes to mind already A Cleric Bard AA with zen archery and boost boost your wisdom.
Well take druid and ranger out of RK they dont fit either when you think about it, and look at the points made by others above + you gave RK gnomes AND made a new wiz favored race for them, GNOME are uber
)As far as the MA and spot thing goes, there must be some way to make a spotter over there, sure you wont get 4 att, unless you are hasted but trust me you dont ALWAYS need 4 attacks around, on here its quality over quantity. Checking the book - Rogue, SD, AA and Wpn Master get spot and You are allowed bard over there to boost that - one build comes to mind already A Cleric Bard AA with zen archery and boost boost your wisdom.
Good Day!, I Said GOOD DAY !