dragon fear aura

[Nyeleni]

Pure druids don't have a fear aura.

[frogofpeace]

My SD, will save 25 unbuffed, failed fafnir's fear aura save twice tonite, in about an hour of fighting including running in and out repeatedly for a while, way more than 2 minutes. (I forget what it was buffed - maybe 30? 35? the only will buff he had that would affect will was great owls. He does have defensive roll, tho. Also, sorry - forgot to look at the battle log and see what the save was ...) I mean ONLY twice - doesn't seem out of line. That's consistent with my previous experience. Maybe the SL guys were running into a bug?

That said, I do think the fear aura is the seventh cheese on the six-cheese pizza that is the RDD dragon shape. They need nerfed more, frankly. As discussed ad nauseum in the other thread(s). I got an idea - give fear aura to CoT's since everybody's so afeared of THEM! Assassin's get nothing.

While I'm on my whine horse, the entrance to the Sleeth temple is too tight. Besides the big fat dragons (that's right, I called you fat!) clogging the door, after a couple runs, the Epic Defenders always seem to migrate there. I'm sure they're drawn by the attackers and I'm NOT implying the defenders move them there as a tactic. Nevertheless, there were 3 Epics (at least - I was jammed behind a door from spawning and couldn't get a camera angle to see anything, much less fight) shoulder to shoulder across the corridor. 3 (at least) GREAT SMITING Epics - too much chance of XP loss in my opinion. If we can't have choke points in Ice Giants (and I LOVE me some choke points in Ice Giants ), I vote get rid of this one.

Edit - someone pointed out NC has a similar narrow point by the door. Maybe that should be changed as well. Maybe make the door flush with the wall. Anyway, my two cents.

[Sohjin]

I'm not able to check in NWN, but if I remember right the entrance to Garagoth temple is the same as Sleeth (we don't get dragons mind) and Ragnars Kin relic room is just tight everywhere (dwarves like it so). Seems pretty standard if 4 relic rooms have tight spots so can't see why it should be changed just because someone devised a successful defense tactic.

[ashsagoon]

NC's relic room has a much worse choke point. If anything the AO one is open compared to NC.

I think frog proves that even with an SD it's not that hard to beat the fear if you build well and wear the right gear.

Oh and all you guys who are failing a DC 31-50 fear, I'd advise you to NEVER EVER go to Dragon Eyrie, the Abyss, Illithids, etc or any of the upper plains where their DCs are MUCH higher and some (like Illithids) are PURE will save not including anything but the number on your sheet.

[DM_Kim]

One small consolation, is that at least with the Fear Aura you kind of "run away" area permitting. Personally I'd like to see that aura changed to something similar to Alzaara's "Bow down and worship me as I beat you to death"

That would be so cute.

[burrahobbit]

NC's relic room has a much worse choke point. If anything the AO one is open compared to NC.

I think frog proves that even with an SD it's not that hard to beat the fear if you build well and wear the right gear.

Oh and all you guys who are failing a DC 31-50 fear, I'd advise you to NEVER EVER go to Dragon Eyrie, the Abyss, Illithids, etc or any of the upper plains where their DCs are MUCH higher and some (like Illithids) are PURE will save not including anything but the number on your sheet.

NC doesnt have dragons to block the door or have any class that has a fear aura.........

[cRaZy8or5e]

NC's relic room has a much worse choke point. If anything the AO one is open compared to NC.

I think frog proves that even with an SD it's not that hard to beat the fear if you build well and wear the right gear.

Oh and all you guys who are failing a DC 31-50 fear, I'd advise you to NEVER EVER go to Dragon Eyrie, the Abyss, Illithids, etc or any of the upper plains where their DCs are MUCH higher and some (like Illithids) are PURE will save not including anything but the number on your sheet.

NC doesnt have dragons to block the door or have any class that has a fear aura.........

We do too have a class with a fear aura, its called a PDK, nasty .

We have the worst choke points as well coming in and out of a cradle, no argument there. While dragons sittin on a door can be a pain in the butt, I think its a great tactic and one that we've all done at one time or another. Anyone remember Eldaquen or was it Nyeleni on Cersei TSS, sitting in that last little doorway to the NC cradle. It may not have been either of them, but Dragons blocking a route is a tactic that everyone has used at one time or another. Even more amusing I've heard and seen DM's make rulings both ways on the use of dragons to block access to cradles and doorways. Some will tell you you're exploiting, others will tell the non-dragons that you gotta kill the dragon in order to get to where you want to go, or find a way to get it to move, or in other words deal with it. I think it was Tep or Chase who told us that when Havoc and his dragon were sitting on the LA cradle. That's the way its been treated most recently, well in my experiences anyway.

In the end, you can view the difficulties that choke points and dragons (with their size and fear auras) create as a challenge to be overcome and enjoyed, OR as an unfair use of game mechanics. For instance many raiders have used the doors and multiple rooms in the NC cradle to great effect in blocking pursuit and hiding again *cough cough* Scarab *cough* something in my throat there. Either way I'll continue to enjoy it as a challenge.

And as far as the nastiness in the planes. Don't give advice like that Ashsagoon, you'll discourage the children.

[burrahobbit]

Does a pdk have a 50 DC fear aura?

[Shadowalker]

*Following the choke point side track*

TC Wolfs Den..
......so open it might as well be outside.. no wait outside would allow faction item to be used within, and rangers to make use of thier special skills (IE Ranger move/speed, outdoor hips)

*tilts the bottle......not a drop * looks like Im out of whine... see ya when I get back from the cellar.

[Cahaal]

*Following the choke point side track*

TC Wolfs Den..
......so open it might as well be outside.. no wait outside would allow faction item to be used within, and rangers to make use of thier special skills (IE Ranger move/speed, outdoor hips)

*tilts the bottle......not a drop * looks like Im out of whine... see ya when I get back from the cellar.

It is in a cave which is technically underground....hint, hint....wonders if a special item might work there.

[frogofpeace]

Yeah, I was more concerned about the nasty smiting Epics all gathered in the choke point. Seems like a lot of potential for XP loss. Anyway, just an observation, they didn't kill my guy or anyone else that I saw, maybe I was overthinking it.

Just give rogues to NC and we'll call it even.

[Tsavong]

I don't quite see what this about how unfair it is that SL dose not have choke points and AO dose has to do fear aura.

Even if a cradle screen is a big featureless square there is still a transition and a cradle, all a dragon (or anyone with a fear aura) has to do is sit on ether of them and you have to run though the aura hoping your will is up to it.

By the way choke points can work against the defender as well as for them the number of times I've run into the MA temple and run head long into a dragons crotch. And I'm sure the npcs have a lot to do with making it easer to defend and they can cluster around the transition choke point or not.

[Bargeld]

Personally, I think the worst of the problems is the fact that the RDD is parked AFK as a dual log toon.

Large, high DC fear aura (no aiming).
Blocks the passageway.
1000 hp and high AC (meaning it can still survive for many rounds while being attacked, unmanned)
Play your other logged toon and let the dragon sit there.

(how does a druid or druid/shifter dragon compare to this tactic?)

[LinuxPup]

Multilogging and parking a character (idling) somewhere isn't acceptable... if a DM finds someone doing that, they probably won't be very happy. DMs have the means to restrict a player to a single login at a time if/when its abused... The only reason we allow multilogging at all is because there are times when players legitimately have more than one person at their house playing, and we don't want to restrict that.

Parking any character (RDD or not), could even result in loss of levels... which, for RDDs means they lose their Ancient Red Dragon ability altogether for a while.

[Chernobyl_Glow]

This game is like rock, scissors, paper sort of. Dragon = Rock. SD = Scissors. Dragon doesn't take sneak damage and SD's have low will saves. It's going to be a waste of time to keep fighting dragons with sneakers.

So basically if you know you are fighting a dragon you have to bring something else. Preferably something with a better will save. Like a cleric or a caster. You can't just start a thread complaining, 'My sd can't beat rdd's therefore they are overpowered.' This whole thread basically admits that you can't build any chars with decent will saves (Guess I should say you just haven't done so yet).

Personally, I think the worst of the problems is the fact that the RDD is parked AFK as a dual log toon.

Large, high DC fear aura (no aiming).
Blocks the passageway.
1000 hp and high AC (meaning it can still survive for many rounds while being attacked, unmanned)
Play your other logged toon and let the dragon sit there.

Pure speculation and totally irrelevant to the point of the thread. In any case your saying that the dragon could beat you even if the player had fallen asleep essentially?

Sorry I missed all this stuff. Looks like it was fun.

- Glow -