Assassin Love

[mining]

We have some super interesting ideas contingent on it all working - I'm talking really super huge big sweeping changes provided it all comes together behind the scenes, which it should by the looks.

[Amoenotep]

then its gonna break

[Lokey]

We need to test that part first (preliminary looks ok).

In broad strokes: up everyone's saves by 10 or so (discuss) in a stackable way that also reports correctly on character sheet, up spell DCs by that amount. Probably still make stun fist non-chainable. Bring back dev crit so you can have fun fitting that feat chain back in

NPC saves need lots of tweaking anyway, so that'll slow things down a bit.

[mining]

We need to test that part first (preliminary looks ok).

NPC saves need lots of tweaking anyway, so that'll slow things down a bit.

Anyway I'm going to commit to saying it'll be out by the end of the year guaranteed because I'm A) confident it'll work and B) if it doesn't, I'll make it work, damnit.

[hond]

Bring back dev crit so you can have fun fitting that feat chain back in

NPC saves need lots of tweaking anyway, so that'll slow things down a bit.

dev crit: mehhh.....
faction who have access to STR shapes, and RDD class will have a definitive advantage...
Stun is OP, but ALL faction have access to him in same condition (only NC can have a little advantage on it)
Dev crit is not ...
AO RDDs with +8 STR for 10 lvls will have a huge advantage compare with the rest (+4 DC)...
I can't imagine a Dragon already hard to beat down, with dev crit.....
just my opinion..

[mining]

Pros of RDD - more DC. Pros of WM - more chances to proc.

Cons of RDD - yeah it's a good class. Cons of WM - 7 levels you can't use for something else?
Also, re: Strength shapes, less than worried - they'll never be as high AB as a WM, for example.

[Daral0085]

And FYI, dragon can't get dev crit because it uses creature weapon, not unarmed. Or at least that's what NWNWiki told me.

[Daltian]

Pros of RDD - more DC. Pros of WM - more chances to proc.

Cons of RDD - yeah it's a good class. Cons of WM - 7 levels you can't use for something else?
Also, re: Strength shapes, less than worried - they'll never be as high AB as a WM, for example.

WM has such a horrible fort save it will get dev. critted more often then it dev. crits others.

I find bringing dev crit back to be a bad idea. If stun was a problem when you needed to build every build just to survive it and you want to limit stunning fist from being chained but you bring in ability that insta kills on crit with same overpowered dc. Seams like flawed reasoning. Low AC toons that suurvive from HP and DR will be hit the hardest since they are critted so much, even if they have 55 fort and dev. crit DC is 57 they will die to it since they roll against it so often.

[mining]

Pros of RDD - more DC. Pros of WM - more chances to proc.

Cons of RDD - yeah it's a good class. Cons of WM - 7 levels you can't use for something else?
Also, re: Strength shapes, less than worried - they'll never be as high AB as a WM, for example.

WM has such a horrible fort save it will get dev. critted more often then it dev. crits others.

I find bringing dev crit back to be a bad idea. If stun was a problem when you needed to build every build just to survive it and you want to limit stunning fist from being chained but you bring in ability that insta kills on crit with same overpowered dc. Seams like flawed reasoning. Low AC toons that suurvive from HP and DR will be hit the hardest since they are critted so much, even if they have 55 fort and dev. crit DC is 57 they will die to it since they roll against it so often.

Read above, the idea is to completely realign the saves system. And possibly disallow RDD + dev crit . The idea is, if everything is realigned so that you can have stun and DC spells coexisting on a "Hey, I can make both of those saves reliably, but making the one doesn't make me autobeat the other" Dev Crit isn't that bad because you'll be making that one as often - and if we disallow it with RDD, it's DC is at the high end of like 53.

[VagaStorm]

Pros of RDD - more DC. Pros of WM - more chances to proc.

Cons of RDD - yeah it's a good class. Cons of WM - 7 levels you can't use for something else?
Also, re: Strength shapes, less than worried - they'll never be as high AB as a WM, for example.

WM has such a horrible fort save it will get dev. critted more often then it dev. crits others.

I find bringing dev crit back to be a bad idea. If stun was a problem when you needed to build every build just to survive it and you want to limit stunning fist from being chained but you bring in ability that insta kills on crit with same overpowered dc. Seams like flawed reasoning. Low AC toons that suurvive from HP and DR will be hit the hardest since they are critted so much, even if they have 55 fort and dev. crit DC is 57 they will die to it since they roll against it so often.

Read above, the idea is to completely realign the saves system. And possibly disallow RDD + dev crit . The idea is, if everything is realigned so that you can have stun and DC spells coexisting on a "Hey, I can make both of those saves reliably, but making the one doesn't make me autobeat the other" Dev Crit isn't that bad because you'll be making that one as often - and if we disallow it with RDD, it's DC is at the high end of like 53.

I've never used devcrit, but if you can get a dc around 53 on something that will roll out 3-4 crits a round like a dual vielding kurki wm, it will be nasty for anyone thats not a pally, the obvious solution is to allow pallys in ao, just in case, then we'll see if dev crit is fesable :p

[VagaStorm]

And for the record, we all know alka just wants this so he can kill me...

[Amoenotep]

they aren't talking like they will unleash dev crit straight out right now. they are going to open up your brain and jack it up first, then see what happens. talking some revamp in all kinds of systems to make it viable without making it own the server.

[mining]

they aren't talking like they will unleash dev crit straight out right now.
talking some revamp in all kinds of systems to make it viable without making it own the server.

Pretty much, yeah.

[Rufio]

Construct Shape = Best Dev Crit DC.

Finally, a shifter build that people are going to be afraid of again

[Alkapwn]

So increase all saves by 10 and make assassins even worse?.... worst thread ever....