Pick Pocket skill and your local rogue

Cahaal · Post by **Cahaal** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:13 pm

Okay so I've noticed something with my lvl 39 pure rogue, I can only steal gold from mobs and players without getting detected. This includes low lvl characters with low spots. Something as small as a scroll or gold strip gets detected. Now my toon has a hide of 93 with a PP skill of 59 (maxed without focus).

It seems unfair that the rogue cannot even steal pots from a pot using mob to help even the score. All the mobs have "on them" is gold if they have anything, but then you kill them and blamo the remains have all kinds of stuff and the whole time you are fighting them they are chugging pots worse than a PM raiding (just a little joke, no flames please

) And the fact is that you can only steal about 60 pieces of gold at a time.

The purpose of this post is to draw attention to this skill and maybe steer others away from my mistake with my lvl 39 pure rogue or to get the skill revamped just a bit. Thanks for taking the time to read my post. Enjoy your day.....and of course HUGZ! <3

Post by **LinuxPup** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:25 pm

Props on getting a pure level 39 rogue. I was thinking of doing something like that, with the rumors of pure rogue bonuses.

disastro · Post by **disastro** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:24 pm

whichever way it goes i do wish pp would remain disabled for pvp. the default implementation is horribly flawed.

if i recall correctly if pp is enabled then there is a flat dc of like 30 to pick pocket someone. it does not require you to be hidden at all, and you can do it while you are in active combat with your target. spot is not a defense against pp, all it does is alert you to what was taken.

this feature is one of the major reasons like 10 active players simply left ns3.5 midwest. for little or no effort you could rob folks blind while you were fighting them (and this was quite abused by some players). it createsd such enormous bad blood when players' earned gear was stripped away in such ridiculous circumstances that people literally would rather not play the game.

it was all "legit" according to the aything-goes-rules, folks were told to suck it up and deal. And eventually the server was left with a short handful of players who then had nobody else to pickpocket.

please... no pvp pickpocket.

$chase$ · Post by **$chase$** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:41 pm

listen save the all your players will leave crap..we have heard it about 100 times before.. the truth is PP is horrible needs work. the other truth is this is THE BEST server out there and believe me we will always have players. that said..ill see about getting the PP skill buffed up some

we have rules on NS4 that will be followed. so PP is not a issue. i use it on my shadow dancer and i love the skill..thanks for the gold bye the way

Cahaal · Post by **Cahaal** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:33 am

Spot is a defense against it. If the rogue gets spotted the item is returned and the person being stole from is alerted to the theft. I have tested it on players with their permission to try and isolate the exact way that PP works. And it does matter if you are hidden. If you are not hidden then the check is a CHA (to distract the victim) vs a flat DC then the seperate spot check.

So you see it isn't a flat DC to steal something. Flat DC is to determine if you can "locate" something to steal. Then it's a hide vs spot or CHA vs spot to see if you can actually take the object.

Post by **Binkyuk** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 6:17 am

have a read of http://www.nsrealm.com/ns4wiki/index.php/Pick_Pocket.
It can't be used in combat (so there's that problem out the window, and if they Spot you and attack you then they're safe). You need high dex to steal heavy items. If the victim is aware then they get a wis vs cha roll to defend. If unaware they get Listen vs MS-5. Then finally they get a reflex vs class levels.

disastro · Post by **disastro** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:50 am

$chase$ wrote:listen save the all your players will leave crap..we have heard it about 100 times before.. the truth is PP is horrible needs work. the other truth is this is THE BEST server out there and believe me we will always have players. that said..ill see about getting the PP skill buffed up some

we have rules on NS4 that will be followed. so PP is not a issue. i use it on my shadow dancer and i love the skill..thanks for the gold bye the way

firstly it's good to hear that pp has been changed here. I was only relating my experiences with pp on ns35. Secondly I made no statements or judgements as to the quality of THIS server (which i happen to like very much and is orders of magnitude better and more fun than any other server i've played).

All I stated were flat out truths about what happened with the playerbase on another server (and if you want to find out what happened to that server... log into reflections sometime

I'm sure you guys hear "and all your players will leave" for every issue someone has a problem with but I thought this was a pretty real and relevant example.

I stand corrected on the pickpocket issue as it seems it has been quite changed on this server (thanks for the link bink). We'll see how it plays out once the possible bugs indicated in this thread get hashed out and we get an entire guild dedicated to pp going

though I would suggest that you should not be able to succeed vs a hostile player who has spotted you.

Post by **Binkyuk** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:47 am

Well, if they attack you then you can't PP them. If they choose not to attack you then they're clearly undecided about you, so you do cha vs wis to misdirect them. Which actually seems pretty darned realistic for a RPG!

Findor · Post by **Findor** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:54 am

this is THE BEST server out there

I have played a lot of servers over 4 years time and some of them have made, with good justification, this very claim. NS4 is a topnotch server, but one shouldn't think there haven't been, and still aren't, others with excellent development staffs. Those that remain at this point, however, tend to be strong or enforced RP servers. One of the things I really like about NS4 is not having to pay a silly penalty (like losing one or two items of gear) for dying. I also think the developers have done a great job with the AI. Sometimes, I actually get annoyed at mobs, which is a testament to how good the AI is (just like getting upset with a character in a movie is a testament to the job the actor is doing).

disastro · Post by **disastro** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:42 pm

Binkyuk wrote:Well, if they attack you then you can't PP them. If they choose not to attack you then they're clearly undecided about you, so you do cha vs wis to misdirect them. Which actually seems pretty darned realistic for a RPG!

well, in real life if i notice someone is trying to hide from me, and i am suspicious/hostile to them, it would be impossible for them to walk up and pick my pockets while i am looking at them. i mean, they could still take stuff but at that point it's more like a mugging and not a pocket-picking.

"clever distracting repartee" is not a tactic i have seen any real life pick pocket use against an alerted, suspicious and hostile target.

if you want "realism" (whatever THAT is worth in a video game) then the thief should remain undetected, or at least "not suspicous looking."