Some precisions

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weasel423
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Re: Some precisions

Post by weasel423 »

mining wrote: True Strike lasts 9 seconds for assassin (iirc)
Does that 9 seconds start as soon as you hit your token or does the 9 seconds start after the round in which you hit the token? If the former, you get, what, 4 seconds?
mining wrote: it sets you up for a bio Death Attack after you morde them.
After you use your scroll to mord them, they just use another FoM rod or cast it before you get a chance to finish the round it takes to read the scroll, corner sneak (if there is an available corner), then get back near them for the death attack, hoping they are not attacking another creature or door by then. Also, Mord scrolls are WAY more expensive to make than FoM rods.
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mining
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Re: Some precisions

Post by mining »

weasel423 wrote:
mining wrote: True Strike lasts 9 seconds for assassin (iirc)
Does that 9 seconds start as soon as you hit your token or does the 9 seconds start after the round in which you hit the token? If the former, you get, what, 4 seconds?
mining wrote: it sets you up for a bio Death Attack after you morde them.
After you use your scroll to mord them, they just use another FoM rod or cast it before you get a chance to finish the round it takes to read the scroll, corner sneak (if there is an available corner), then get back near them for the death attack, hoping they are not attacking another creature or door by then. Also, Mord scrolls are WAY more expensive to make than FoM rods.
Former

Re: Latter, I'm fairly sure your ethereal is an instant cast, so you can blow it before they can re FoM if you're fast enough
Bargeld wrote:Overall, I think most would agree that a pure rogue is probably the worst build on the server.

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Re: Some precisions

Post by Korr »

hond wrote: What is crazy nice ability ??
On Assassin level 4 they can cast True Strike 1x/day as a level 5 caster.same effect with 1 wiz/sorcThose wizards get worse BAB, trade off like anything else
On Assassin level 6 they can cast Cat's Grace 1x/day as a level 15 caster.same as rodno need a rod, or 300
On Assassin level 10 they get Permanent Ultravision Permanence vs temporal scroll,helm, gearnon-dispellable means nothing does it?
On Assassin level 11 they can cast Fox's Cunning 1x/day as a level 15 caster.same as rodagain without the need for a rod... its free
On Assassin level 15 they can cast Freedom of Movement 1x/day as a level 7 caster.better the rodrod in this case is better because its on strip list
On Assassin level 15 the Improved Invisibility feat improves to 60% concealment.+10 % compared with rod,but only lvl 7 for dispell checkmining covered this
On Assassin level 20 they can cast Clairaudience/Clairvoyance 3x/day as a level 15 caster.+5 lv compared with scrollsand its free again...

In all that list i don't see anything a rogueX/wizard1 Can't do ... +10 % conceal and perma UV as top featsexcept no wiz dip to lose a class and AB?

On Assassin level 20 Improved Ghostly Visage - Assassin becomes Ethereal for 1rd
On Assassin level 30 Improved Ghostly Visage - Assassin becomes Ethereal for 2rds

And you need a unique prestige class, 20 and 30 lvl , to be untouchable during 1 and 2 rounds...but what do you do during those 6 and 12 seconds...It's a good defensive feat..nothing more...not worth going 30 assassin for that...adding that using this feat dispell your best argument to kill oponentIf YOU use it defensively thats fine, but its totally possible to sneak into a room para someone (or mord), use your FREE ACTION ethreal then para a second (or the mord'd person)

And finaly the death attack...I will not explaining how easy is, to counter it...this has already been beaten to death, go read that thread again
Just saying that the maximum ever DC is 60
Reach that number is prolly imposible in PvP terms, as you need to go 30 assassin,max Int start, Int race , a +4 book, all Int during leveling,using 6 epic feat in INT and only in temple, which toon will run with 47 AB, and so nub stats, that just imposible to see in real ( only Alka can made that :lol:) ...And you only have 1 shoot
Adding there some extra conditions not mentioned by wiki( You need initiative), so that toon need bloody, initiative and superior initiative feats, making it worst, if that posible...
The Death attack is so hard to make working , and the average DC so mediocre, that assassin are gadget toons...You can make 1 , and use it against a 45-50 fort toon with no spot/ detection, no UMD (in case you want to paralyze), and only in defense ...wich reduct drasticaly the utility of it. Welcome to diversity?
On top of that, if oponent save your death attack, killing him will result a funny task.Corner sneak anyone?
If you don't want a Death attack DC toon, you will not use assassin but rogue, for same sneak damages, more feats, more skills points, Epic dodge, crippling strike, and posibility to cross class with other prestige class (like BG to compensate your awfull saves)...Amazing if you DONT want death attack you DONT build an assassin... what point are you making?

PD: a pure fighter Wisdom (+2 race,+4 book ,+10 lvl ,+6 epic feat) CAN have 12 shoots at 72 DC stun fist (every where)+ KD token+ 20 AB token. Just to compare with max dc 60 (in Temple)+20 token doesnt work on fists, no umd, no uncanny dodge, no spot, no corner sneaking, and its stun... not death
If you cant see anything good in the unique PrC of your faction you like either dont build them, learn HOW to build them, or move to a new faction. Just stop complaining about them!


/e : color readability
Last edited by Korr on Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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mining
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Re: Some precisions

Post by mining »

Like I said, we're looking at 'sin because we don't really like how SL gets the shittiest unique PRC (in terms of overall ability to contribute to fights in multiple arenas of battle).
Bargeld wrote:Overall, I think most would agree that a pure rogue is probably the worst build on the server.

hond
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Re: Some precisions

Post by hond »

If you don't want a Death attack DC toon, you will not use assassin but rogue, for same sneak damages, more feats, more skills points, Epic dodge, crippling strike, and posibility to cross class with other prestige class (like BG to compensate your awfull saves)...Amazing if you DONT want death attack you DONT build an assassin... what point are you making?
that's the point...our unique prestige class is avaible for only 1 build...the DC version...and it's just a mediocre toon, who need lots of inversion in level (28 to 30) for a very reduced utility ( in menzo , vs no detection toon AND low fort)
Why building it, if a rogue/stunner will made same work or better vs the same type toon, whith higher survivability, and everywhere (hiden tunnels, forest cave) ...
If you cant see anything good in the unique PrC of your faction you like either dont build them, learn HOW to build them, or move to a new faction. Just stop complaining about them!
Do you think there is lot of variation in a Assassin DC ?? you need a base quantity of feat, who made the toon really easy to make on sheet... other history is to level it to 40, as in High lvls , you get spoted or mobs have Bio TS...
And no, i don't have to moove to other faction.
This place is made to allow the players explain a case, and if devs thinks, they're right, they try to change it...
If i follow your crazy mind, it's like: if solar is weaker, just moove to a faction who can get a baalor and stop complain of it...surrealist reflexion...
Last edited by hond on Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:17 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Some precisions

Post by hond »

True Strike lasts 9 seconds for assassin (iirc)
True strike last 9 seconds for a lvl 1 wizard
True strike last 9 second for a lvl 40 wizard

Tested in game several time....

mining
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Re: Some precisions

Post by mining »

hond wrote:
True Strike lasts 9 seconds for assassin (iirc)
True strike last 9 seconds for a lvl 1 wizard
True strike last 9 second for a lvl 40 wizard

Tested in game several time....

-Improved duration of Assassin's True Strike ability to 18 seconds. This does not affect the spell True Strike, which remains at 9 seconds.

Sorry, I didn't check the changelog. Standard is 9 seconds, 'sin gets 18 seconds.
Bargeld wrote:Overall, I think most would agree that a pure rogue is probably the worst build on the server.

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Re: Some precisions

Post by hond »

Roger..

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Re: Some precisions

Post by Korr »

hond wrote:
If you cant see anything good in the unique PrC of your faction you like either dont build them, learn HOW to build them, or move to a new faction. Just stop complaining about them!
Do you think there is lot of variation in a Assassin DC ?? you need a base quantity of feat, who made the toon really easy to make on sheet... other history is to level it to 40, as in High lvls , you get spoted or mobs have Bio TS...
And no, i don't have to moove to other faction.
This place is made to allow the players explain a case, and if devs thinks, they're right, they try to change it...
If i follow your crazy mind, it's like: if solar is weaker, just moove to a faction who can get a baalor and stop complain of it...surrealist reflexion...
No one said you HAVE to move to another faction. No one said you COULDNT make constructive criticism about Assassin. What a LOT of people are saying is quit complaining about it. There is a thread for assassin, and there are threads for other things. Lots of these threads for OTHER things you drag "CoT and PDK are OP" "AO token is OP" "Sin sucks" into... and it DOES NOT belong there.

When I first got back to playing here bigby had been changed. When I ran some numbers and did some tests (I have 2 focused wizards) I sent mining (the dev in the log for that change) a PM about it, we had some back and forth about the numbers and power, etc. There was also some good (on topic!) discussion on another forum about it... then someone else entirely brought it up here. Shortly afterwards it got modified.

Complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining, and complaining about the same things will not entice the devs to get to it faster... its a long enough process as is (with few people with less time).
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Nocturne
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Re: Some precisions

Post by Nocturne »

Damn dude,are sure you're past puberty? That last post is pretty immature.
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Re: Some precisions

Post by Korr »

Nocturne wrote:Damn dude,are sure you're past puberty? That last post is pretty immature.
copy, paste... soo difficult
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Nocturne
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Re: Some precisions

Post by Nocturne »

Thanks for making my point.
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Re: Some precisions

Post by Korr »

It takes something like 4 pages of honds searched posts to get out of the last 2 threads of basic constant complaints... after a page or so you hit more complaints (3-4 more pages of MOSTly complaints)...
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Re: Some precisions

Post by Bargeld »

Bargeld wrote:Korr
...
You aren't adding to the topics, you are subtracting from them.
Bargeld wrote:Korr
...
The point is that YOU can't bring anything valid to the discussion that actually furthers the discussion. All that YOU can do is throw your opinions and insult people. GTFO.
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