item level restrictions

dond · Post by **dond** » Mon May 03, 2004 12:44 am

i like the item lvl restrictions...........some of the gear is clearly overpowered to be worn by lvl 1 (gustav's, faction gear etc)

also, equipment changes are a good money sink too, since every so often it's time for an upgrade at the smith!

ATI · Post by **ATI** » Mon May 03, 2004 12:57 am

But, to me, the purpose is to get players to get together and play wih each other. The best way to do that is to make an incentive, which everyone agrees with

.

The logistics can be argued amongst the devs, but my vote is for giving more exp for working together than you would soloing (maybe not much like 2-4 at first then maybe 20-30 for higher levels and maybe 40-70 for the highest levels). That sort of incentive would go a long way to making parties more cohesive in the game and also in their application to the real world.

Gil-Este · Post by **Gil-Este** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:00 am

if you get more xp for working together than you do for soloing then pretty soon there could be parties of 10-15 people all sharing the same monsters and getting huge synergy bonuses. juice up the synergy bonuses some, but don't give more xp for two people killing one monster than for one person killing the same monster

ATI · Post by **ATI** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:30 am

You don't need to make the synergy bonus get that high. You're just being hyper critical Gil. You assume that 10-15 people would ever be in the same place at once. You seem to assume the devs lack the programing imagination that god granted pistacios. Do you really believe the devs would just go....oh synergy bonuses!! lets just allow people to get Tons of exp through their parties.....Thats not how it happens with devs. The way it works is the devs would do something like this...

DD: Alright everyone here we go.... seems people think increasing the synergy bonuses would be a great thing to do for the low lvl chars.

Anonymous 1: What do we do to make sure that people don't exploit the synergy bonus then?

Anonymous 2: Okay...so maybe we should put a cap on the synergy bonus. Give players the ability to get more exp than they would soloing, but only slightly maybe 3-4 exp more per kill which would gradualy get bigger as monsters got better. After that we could cap the bonuses to only 2-4 chars in the party. Anything above 4 players experiences the same exp increase as 4 players, making sure abuse can't happen.

DD: Sounds good to me, what else we got?

Anonymous 1: Well this seems to end the problems with partying, and it also might assuage the anger we've been getting with regard to ILRs.

DD: Alright three birds with one large stone!

Anonymous 2: Dude, i'm hungry, Dominos sound good?

DD: Dominos

Anonymous 1: Dominos

Nuff said

JesterOI · Post by **JesterOI** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:34 am

If a monster drops an base xp of 100 when killed by a solo PC, a party should get no more than 100xp (depending on PC level) each for that same kill.

Party synergy should not exceed what you would get solo, they should be equal IMO.

ATI · Post by **ATI** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:43 am

Yeah, but that doesn't add incentive to partying. You go from an average 100 for soloing to a simple 110-120 for grouping with 4+ players, and you get players working together. Mathematically that means you are killing say for 500 exp... With the exp bonus that makes it only 480 (iwh synergy bonus party of 4) after kililng 4 monsters. So essentially you kill one less monster per every 5 monster. Sure it adds up, but if your multiclassing 2 or 3 (depending on race and class) then it balances out with the 20% exp penalty.

JesterOI · Post by **JesterOI** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:57 am

JesterOI wrote:If a monster drops an base xp of 100 when killed by a solo PC, a party should get no more than 100xp (depending on PC level) each for that same kill.

Of course getting the same xp for a kill while partying that you would while soloing is incentive. You get the same amount of xp but way easier and more safely.

Why would I want to solo X monster and get 100xp when I could bring a friend to help kill him and get the same 100xp but with help? Not to mention my buddy gets 100xp also if he is the same level.

Æ · Post by Æ » Mon May 03, 2004 2:15 am

I think the NPC henchman thing is a great idea, casters have a major advantage in both leveling and PvP because of their summons [not to mention that most things have physical immunities/resistances, but not magical defences of the same sort, but that's another topic}:)], henchmen would level the playing field a bit in that respect.

AndrewCarr · Post by **AndrewCarr** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:31 am

Improved animal companions to match summons would be nice. That and improving their buffing spells. Not sure about the druid one since it may unbalance the class, but i don't see many high level druids, so i'm not completely sure what effect it'd have.

Gil-Este · Post by **Gil-Este** » Mon May 03, 2004 6:47 pm

ATI having there be more experience for killing a monster in party than solo makes absolutely no sense. 1) experience is supposed to be based on the difficulty you had killing the monster, so four people killing someone should get at least a little bit less experience than one of those people soloing the monster 2) even if the devs put in a cap to prevent abuse its still punishing people who want to solo if you can kill harder mobs for more xp in a party. the feeling i seem to be getting from playing the mod and reading the forums is that the devs want to encourage partying but don't seem to have any desire to punish those who want to solo. getting more xp for easier kills in a party would eliminate the viability of the lone wolf player, as a party would better be able to dominate a good leveling spot and would be able to level much more quickly 3) players in a party can kill harder monsters than any one of them could, further escalating the problem of XP inflation

i think synergy bonuses should be juiced up, but logically if the devs want to provide incentives for partying but not rule out the possibility of solo play, then the synergy bonuses should IMO add up to slightly less than the solo xp or at the very least should equal the solo xp.

Revenge · Post by **Revenge** » Mon May 03, 2004 7:56 pm

Heh as it turns out, you only get crappy party xp when you have big lvl differences.

I solo an orc grunt and get around 20xp. I get in a party with 2 lvl 5 and myself (lvl 4), and suddenly each orc is giving me around 10xp with a +4 synergy bonus. Us 3 together absolutely storm through the orc caves and we end up getting xp faster than before. Ofcourse, as soon as that lvl 10+ joins the party, I start getting 4xp per monster and no synergy bonus...

Basically what seems to be happening is this:
1) Total lvls of party members are added together.
In the above example, 5+5+4=14.

2) Any xp earnt is divided by the amount of lvls in the party.
If a monster gave 70 xp, then 70/14=5

3) You then get each share of the split up xp based on your levels.
So I get 5x4=20xp, and the other 2 get 5x5=25xp each (20+25+25=70).

Ofcourse, the above is missing a lot of factors. For instance all 3 of us were drow, and fighting CR 4 monsters. Our average party level would have been almost 8, so the xp would have been heavily reduced before division, and I don't know non synergy party xp bonus would have been factored in as well.

Moral of the story? Don't party with anybody more than 1 level above you or they'll suck up all the xp and leave you with none.

Eg: lvl 9 takes a lvl 1 out hunting: The monster gives 100xp, and the lvl 9 gets 90 of it while the lvl 1 only gets 10 per kill.

ATI · Post by **ATI** » Mon May 03, 2004 8:28 pm

hehehe fine, I just liked that pistacio line