assassins

mgrjebbo · Post by **mgrjebbo** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:00 pm

hmmm doesnt seem that there is anything wrong with the spell as is, never had a problem with it before.

if it aint broke dont fix it. i think thats someting that needs to be said alot more often.

Post by **Binkyuk** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:06 pm

mgrjebbo wrote:hmmm doesnt seem that there is anything wrong with the spell as is, never had a problem with it before.

er. yes. that's the point. we're discussing making it worse, not better.

I hardly think druids *need* spells like Freedom any more than clerics do. I see your point with ranger though.

It's possible that i'm confused by the Initiative rules, but it seems MLoki is saying that if you attack someone and you have a much better Initiative than them you can get them flatfoot even after they issue the command to attack you. Is this right?

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:40 pm

no, they have to actually be flat footed, initiative has nothing to do with sneaks and D/A. a rogue's sneaks will fire if he is not being actively attacked by his prey..as will assassin sneaks. the D/A will not fire unless your quarry is out of combat from anything. which means you have to fire within 25ft of something just standing there without being seen.

that is where the major downsides of assassin come in..if you can't fire off that D/A your just a poorly skilled rogue without all the cool xtra feats. when you look at the blanket immunity freedom offers a caster/arcane crafter its really a super powerful spell on NS4.

PeregrineV · Post by **PeregrineV** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:11 pm

So does Death attack not work, or does it only work in certain situations? If its situational, then that's self balancing, it seems. When those situations are right, death attack will result in....death. When the situation is not right (buffed and/or alert opponent), then the assassin can wait or use his other skills.

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:27 pm

it only fires if no one knows your there, you get the first shot, you hit, and they fail the save...assassins don't get much use of any of their other skills except casting invis 1/day. poison use is obsolete for now and freedom makes you immune to it for hours on end.

i think i heard on the next patch freedom doesn't protect from it though.

mgrjebbo · Post by **mgrjebbo** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 3:41 pm

ok without freedom of movement a 30th level cleric can and usualy will fail a save for grease... a first level mage spell, which renders said cleric on his back. even if they do make their save they are still slowed. this is a first lvl spell, so what are you saying? that a first level spell should own a 30th level cleric?

again as i said before its not broke there has never been a problem with this spell before so leave it be.

on a side note if this is changed anyone going to zons in the level range of 20-30 that doesnt have a huge save will spam comlaints and such on the boards until it is changed back. without it the dc on the zons stone hold would have to be much lower than it is now, so your not only changing this spell but all the movement effecting spells server wide....

pandora's box if you ask me

Saya Nightshade · Post by **Saya Nightshade** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 4:29 pm

Without freedom (Or it's benifits as is) it seems that these death attacks are sure fire death.. and that those with freedom have a defence. Why take that away? Nothing as simple as one hit should grant a class a garanteed kill if so, bring back the old bigsbys while you're at it

Just my opinion.

PeregrineV · Post by **PeregrineV** » Fri Aug 18, 2006 4:56 pm

Hmm, it seems like Death Attack works as a tool for the assassin the way it is supposed to.
Remember this?

I think that 2-3 minutes of total paralyzation would count as instant death.

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:51 am

freedom will never get changed, the only thing that was brought up about changing it was flailer saying maybe the duration is too long. as it is now you can extend freedom and run most of the server without it shutting down.

how does an assassin lie in wait for his prey if they can just travel around with a spell that makes his lying in wait useless?

Nemesis Revised · Post by **Nemesis Revised** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 4:40 am

make death attack not have a paralysis effect

Kirg · Post by **Kirg** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 7:59 am

Funny and what effect should it have otherwise?
Maybe the killing effect? In pnp it would be fortitude save against the DC of 10 + assassin class lvl + int. modifier. And the assassin would be able to chose if it wants to paralyze or kill the victim.

MasterYoda · Post by **MasterYoda** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:29 pm

I got an idea.

if u are an assassian and u see someone with freedom up don't attack them.

play your str nor your weaknesses.

problem solved.

Nemesis Revised · Post by **Nemesis Revised** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:51 pm

while there is more backlash on freedom being gimped, i'd say give the sneak attack have an effect that freedom does not cover

an assassin is an assassin. he is meant to kill.

Kromix · Post by **Kromix** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 2:53 pm

he IS meant to kill... but not everything.

why did mages get nerfed? they killed everyhting.

there are things an assasin cant kill, and you guys want to target mostly clerics. live with it, leard to know when to retret... and assasin doesnt always go blindly to try to make the kill... they hide and prowl and when they are weak... stab!

Death Dealer1 · Post by **Death Dealer1** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 3:29 pm

so...i'm supposed to kill goblins and ogres until i get to lvl 40 with my assassin then?