make bigbys a discipline save just like Bastions of War has it...may seem like copying...but hell...it works...its savable but still good vs those who didnt mind to put some focus on discipline in their buildLokey wrote:I don't know how many times I've rewritten the Bigby's spells...
More pk whining
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TheBestDeception
- Developer
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- Location: New York City, NY
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There is a difference between PvP and PK; people generally support PvP (agreed upon fighting and such, though not necessarily arena) but dislike PK (one-sided attacks; Nomius).Terminal Insanity wrote:What is the point in playing online if all you're going to do is solo XP? To gain levels? for what? to kill me? hah. Thought you didn't like PvP. You just don't like it when it happens to YOU.
Regardless, what I see is a group of people who have a thing in common: they dislike PK's. How about making a guild which would reflect such, a protector guild of sorts...
(a PERFECT example of such a guild can be found here: http://www.nsrealm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=1845)
But, it's such a draining job that, until you've DMed on an NWN server yourself, you the playerbase, have got to cut the DMs some slack. - Flailer
Not again...... *sigh*
Normally I leave these types of posts alone. However, I am so sick and tired of this useless complaining, that I feel a little help is in order.
So far I have seen a very simple and unimaginative pattern to the pvp troubles we are supposedly having.
1) First player kills second player.
2) Second player whines.
3) Third, fourth, and fifth players join in the whining.
4) Repeat.
5) Over and over and over and over.......
I'm not sure what you all are hoping for exactly. Perhaps you are just waiting for one of the DM's to get so tired of your whining that Term (or anyone else who pk's you) is permanently banned. Well first of all, I really don't see that happening here. Second, I would be the first if not the loudest person to object to such nonsense.
How about instead of all this useless noise, we try some constructive alternatives?
1) After you are pk'ed once, try asking the player not to kill you again. Have any of you even tried that? You failed to mention it if you did. If you are killed once, DEAL WITH IT! A single pk is allowed here even if you are level 1 and he is 40. If you are killed repeatedly after asking the player to leave you alone (and you haven't done anything to provoke them after that), only then are you being grieved. If so, alert a DM.
2) Ask for help. I would love a little pvp action to spice things up around here. If you can't defend yourself or simply don't want to, there are people out there that will come to your aid. Mental has already volunteered and I offer my services as well.
3) Speaking of help: TBD's suggestion of forming guilds is a great one. You will be much harder to pk if you are surrounded by guild members. There really is strength in numbers. Form a mob and hunt the hunters.
4) Go somewhere else. If a pk'er is camping somewhere and killing you repeatedly, don't keep doing the same thing expecting different results. Move on. We have two servers with many, many areas. It is quite easy to hide from someone. Also, most of us have more than one character. Consider switching until the threat is gone.
5) Last, and least in my book: If someone is demanding payment for safe passage -- pay them. I would rather die a thousand horrible deaths, but this could be an option if you really just want to get xp in your favorite area.
PS - For the record, Term has NEVER pk'ed me in any form EVER. Wonder if this is pure luck or if he's just smart enough to stay away?
So far I have seen a very simple and unimaginative pattern to the pvp troubles we are supposedly having.
1) First player kills second player.
2) Second player whines.
3) Third, fourth, and fifth players join in the whining.
4) Repeat.
5) Over and over and over and over.......
I'm not sure what you all are hoping for exactly. Perhaps you are just waiting for one of the DM's to get so tired of your whining that Term (or anyone else who pk's you) is permanently banned. Well first of all, I really don't see that happening here. Second, I would be the first if not the loudest person to object to such nonsense.
How about instead of all this useless noise, we try some constructive alternatives?
1) After you are pk'ed once, try asking the player not to kill you again. Have any of you even tried that? You failed to mention it if you did. If you are killed once, DEAL WITH IT! A single pk is allowed here even if you are level 1 and he is 40. If you are killed repeatedly after asking the player to leave you alone (and you haven't done anything to provoke them after that), only then are you being grieved. If so, alert a DM.
2) Ask for help. I would love a little pvp action to spice things up around here. If you can't defend yourself or simply don't want to, there are people out there that will come to your aid. Mental has already volunteered and I offer my services as well.
3) Speaking of help: TBD's suggestion of forming guilds is a great one. You will be much harder to pk if you are surrounded by guild members. There really is strength in numbers. Form a mob and hunt the hunters.
4) Go somewhere else. If a pk'er is camping somewhere and killing you repeatedly, don't keep doing the same thing expecting different results. Move on. We have two servers with many, many areas. It is quite easy to hide from someone. Also, most of us have more than one character. Consider switching until the threat is gone.
5) Last, and least in my book: If someone is demanding payment for safe passage -- pay them. I would rather die a thousand horrible deaths, but this could be an option if you really just want to get xp in your favorite area.
PS - For the record, Term has NEVER pk'ed me in any form EVER. Wonder if this is pure luck or if he's just smart enough to stay away?
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isaac.anthony
- Noob
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 1:00 pm
have to chime in.
ok first off, i don't know if you guys have noticed, but NS seems to be lacking in players as of late. which makes it a little difficult to start a guild. not to mention what are a bunch of low levels gonna do against an epic character?
i don't think anyone has a problem with a PK every now and again (for roleplaying sake is always best) but it's the CONSTANT harrasment by some PK'rs that is the big problem here.
how is a bunch of low level characters gonna stand-up against anyone? it's not like a epic character can chaperone lowbies all the time. and the good PK'rs build characters just to PK. not everyone wants to make a PK build, and if you try to fight a PK build with a non-PK-build, guess who's gonna win?
if the few people that insist on being psychotic would just stop harrassing low levels all the [censored] time, PROBLEM SOLVED. but, alas, it seems psychotic behavior is encouraged here, so it's not like that's gonna happen.
i'm just gonna go try another world that doesn't encourage childish behavior, have fun PKing the 3 people that are left on NS...
ok first off, i don't know if you guys have noticed, but NS seems to be lacking in players as of late. which makes it a little difficult to start a guild. not to mention what are a bunch of low levels gonna do against an epic character?
i don't think anyone has a problem with a PK every now and again (for roleplaying sake is always best) but it's the CONSTANT harrasment by some PK'rs that is the big problem here.
how is a bunch of low level characters gonna stand-up against anyone? it's not like a epic character can chaperone lowbies all the time. and the good PK'rs build characters just to PK. not everyone wants to make a PK build, and if you try to fight a PK build with a non-PK-build, guess who's gonna win?
if the few people that insist on being psychotic would just stop harrassing low levels all the [censored] time, PROBLEM SOLVED. but, alas, it seems psychotic behavior is encouraged here, so it's not like that's gonna happen.
i'm just gonna go try another world that doesn't encourage childish behavior, have fun PKing the 3 people that are left on NS...
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DrakhanValane
- Arrogant Snob
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- Location: Five Minutes Before the End of Eternity (or Maryland, take your pick)
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Like me! My virgin eyes are bleeding now... T_TJesterOI wrote:Watch the language plz!!! There are apparently kids that read this forum!!! :shock:
If you tilt your head far enough and squint hard enough, anything becomes as simple or complex as you'd like--regardless of whether it is or not. -- A lesson learned from Stephen Wolfram's A New Kind of Science
for those of you that are complaining about being killed more then once. i noticed that you didnt write how, after your killed you go back and attack nomuis..or jump on shout channel and let the server now how upset you are that you were just killed.
so its bad for nomuis to kill you. BUT when you go back after him and he kills you again this is his fault. or after he kills you you get on shout and egg him on to kill you again by talking smack to him.
when i play if it looks like a good fight i may attack..lol..more then likely. if you swear at me in shout and cry then yes ill kill you again when i see you. and if you come back at me im going to try and kill you.
this is a PVP server if some one shows up red to you . get ready to fight or run.
if you are killed over and over.then screen shot it and send it to a DM
and if some one is egging you on to kill them over and over again screen shot it so you have proof.
its a game with a great DM staff and DEVs. read the rules play by them
so its bad for nomuis to kill you. BUT when you go back after him and he kills you again this is his fault. or after he kills you you get on shout and egg him on to kill you again by talking smack to him.
when i play if it looks like a good fight i may attack..lol..more then likely. if you swear at me in shout and cry then yes ill kill you again when i see you. and if you come back at me im going to try and kill you.
this is a PVP server if some one shows up red to you . get ready to fight or run.
if you are killed over and over.then screen shot it and send it to a DM
and if some one is egging you on to kill them over and over again screen shot it so you have proof.
its a game with a great DM staff and DEVs. read the rules play by them
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lord_modred
- Spam Master General
- Posts: 864
- Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2003 2:39 am
- Location: pirating the spanish maine
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There are very few people who are on this pvp server who will complain about getting pk’d. Of course there are some who think that this is just a pvm server and who will cry instantly that they are attacked by a similar leveled character.
What I started out with was one particular player who kill anyone in his sight at any time. He also paid close attention to extremely low leveled characters claiming that he was having fun his way and to hell with the rest or what anyone said because he was (in his mind) within the rules.
Example of his play style. Your level 5 is killing bandits at Rock Peak. He come into the zone with his level 25 or 26 character from Frost Dale on his way to Avendel. See you as a level 5 and pk’s you. You respawn to Avendel. Hit Shout and let him know he just killed a level 5 then you
start to make your way back to Rock Peak. As you leave you get a couple of zones out of Avendel when you happen upon him and again. Guess what. You get pk’d again. (Now that did not happen to me, I decided to log for other reasons than getting pk’d after I respawned.) But it has happened repeatedly to another character of mine as well as to many other players.
That is what the crying is about. Not that it was a one off situation. But there are some who will pk a lowbie and the same lowbie 2, 3 maybe 5 times in the same hour. That’s where the complaint comes from. No honor, no respect and so selfish in “their” own gratification completely at the expense of others. This situation gets worse when a poor lowbie character has taken 30 minutes or so to travel from Garagoth, Daeron or Sleath to bind in Avendel to work leveling their character from there. Some epic leveled character just happens to be leaving Avendel and your just coming up on it and “Bang” you get sent back to where you started from. If it was once. Well you are on a pvp server. But to have it happen again after informing that player of your level, simply put, chases that person playing that low level right off the server because they think that they’ll get pk’d over and over before they have had a chance to level.
If your around enough you’ll see it in shouts.... the attitudes. I watched as someone mentioned that their level 3 just got pk’d by what I knew to be a level 24 at that time, the response from that level 24 was, more or less, your on a pk server get use to it. Never saw that lowbie log back.
If your attitude is: Well to bad for the lowbie and pk them a second and a third time. Then fully expect to hear the, what you call, whining. And fully expect the number of player not to increase.
But if you mention back to that person in tell: Oh well. I’ll leave you alone for a few days and actually leave then alone and let them fight pvp with similar level characters then the numbers might increase.
You read more or less the same complaints about the same players killing off lowbies over and over and over and over. Then you get the same replies:
#1. We’re within the rules.
#2. If you don’t want your character to get killed what are you doing on a pvp server.
#3. Suck it up and stop your whining.
Folks a little respect goes a long way. #1. Listen to the complaints and see if there is a pattern to them.
#2. If you do pk a lowbie intentionally regardless of how they react in shout or on the forums, offer them a kind word of understanding and mention that you’ll avoid them for a few days to give them a chance.
#3. Spend 20 second and look over the player list before you log in and mark your targets. As of late, the majority of people in game are well below level 10. Few are between 10 and 20 and even less are epic.
#4. PvP anyone in certain areas. Like Frost Dale. If your there regardless of level your suppose to be able to hold your own. Same on the upper trails of Giant Mountain, the Undersea City and other higher mob spawned areas.
#4. Carry some rez scroll. if you auto attack and pk a lowbie or did so intentionally at least by rezing them you make a sort of peace offering by rezing them.
My (at the time) level 13 AA attacked a level 18 wizard in Frost Dale. Guess who got well rested in the INN. Today, my AA now level 20 got pk’d by a player who was blue to me. Missed their logging in and I simply couldn’t react fast enough to return an attack. Instead I kept firing away at the mob I was fighting. But that’s life in Neversummer. No complaints there.
If you want to go after lowbies then do so. But why not make a perma lowbie character for just that purpose. Say around level 5 or 6 and pk away at the level 2 and 3's to your hearts content if that’s what turns you on. But most definitely cut lowbies some slack if they are under level 10
and your above level 15.
What I started out with was one particular player who kill anyone in his sight at any time. He also paid close attention to extremely low leveled characters claiming that he was having fun his way and to hell with the rest or what anyone said because he was (in his mind) within the rules.
Example of his play style. Your level 5 is killing bandits at Rock Peak. He come into the zone with his level 25 or 26 character from Frost Dale on his way to Avendel. See you as a level 5 and pk’s you. You respawn to Avendel. Hit Shout and let him know he just killed a level 5 then you
start to make your way back to Rock Peak. As you leave you get a couple of zones out of Avendel when you happen upon him and again. Guess what. You get pk’d again. (Now that did not happen to me, I decided to log for other reasons than getting pk’d after I respawned.) But it has happened repeatedly to another character of mine as well as to many other players.
That is what the crying is about. Not that it was a one off situation. But there are some who will pk a lowbie and the same lowbie 2, 3 maybe 5 times in the same hour. That’s where the complaint comes from. No honor, no respect and so selfish in “their” own gratification completely at the expense of others. This situation gets worse when a poor lowbie character has taken 30 minutes or so to travel from Garagoth, Daeron or Sleath to bind in Avendel to work leveling their character from there. Some epic leveled character just happens to be leaving Avendel and your just coming up on it and “Bang” you get sent back to where you started from. If it was once. Well you are on a pvp server. But to have it happen again after informing that player of your level, simply put, chases that person playing that low level right off the server because they think that they’ll get pk’d over and over before they have had a chance to level.
If your around enough you’ll see it in shouts.... the attitudes. I watched as someone mentioned that their level 3 just got pk’d by what I knew to be a level 24 at that time, the response from that level 24 was, more or less, your on a pk server get use to it. Never saw that lowbie log back.
If your attitude is: Well to bad for the lowbie and pk them a second and a third time. Then fully expect to hear the, what you call, whining. And fully expect the number of player not to increase.
But if you mention back to that person in tell: Oh well. I’ll leave you alone for a few days and actually leave then alone and let them fight pvp with similar level characters then the numbers might increase.
You read more or less the same complaints about the same players killing off lowbies over and over and over and over. Then you get the same replies:
#1. We’re within the rules.
#2. If you don’t want your character to get killed what are you doing on a pvp server.
#3. Suck it up and stop your whining.
Folks a little respect goes a long way. #1. Listen to the complaints and see if there is a pattern to them.
#2. If you do pk a lowbie intentionally regardless of how they react in shout or on the forums, offer them a kind word of understanding and mention that you’ll avoid them for a few days to give them a chance.
#3. Spend 20 second and look over the player list before you log in and mark your targets. As of late, the majority of people in game are well below level 10. Few are between 10 and 20 and even less are epic.
#4. PvP anyone in certain areas. Like Frost Dale. If your there regardless of level your suppose to be able to hold your own. Same on the upper trails of Giant Mountain, the Undersea City and other higher mob spawned areas.
#4. Carry some rez scroll. if you auto attack and pk a lowbie or did so intentionally at least by rezing them you make a sort of peace offering by rezing them.
My (at the time) level 13 AA attacked a level 18 wizard in Frost Dale. Guess who got well rested in the INN. Today, my AA now level 20 got pk’d by a player who was blue to me. Missed their logging in and I simply couldn’t react fast enough to return an attack. Instead I kept firing away at the mob I was fighting. But that’s life in Neversummer. No complaints there.
If you want to go after lowbies then do so. But why not make a perma lowbie character for just that purpose. Say around level 5 or 6 and pk away at the level 2 and 3's to your hearts content if that’s what turns you on. But most definitely cut lowbies some slack if they are under level 10
and your above level 15.
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JesterOI
- Resident Spam King
- Posts: 1016
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I think it's just the popular thing to do nowadays, cry and complain about term killin ya...
"NOMIUS you big duhm head!!! You think you're so cool killing level 5's with your level 26!!! Does it make you feel big?!!! I'm gonna tattle on you like a spoiled little 1st grader!!! Just let me get this all on shout first though!!!"
Damn, I feel hot!
"NOMIUS you big duhm head!!! You think you're so cool killing level 5's with your level 26!!! Does it make you feel big?!!! I'm gonna tattle on you like a spoiled little 1st grader!!! Just let me get this all on shout first though!!!"
Damn, I feel hot!
LVL 69 LFGS!!!
The Hasselhoff 4 3v3r!!! Metis n3v3r!!!
The Hasselhoff 4 3v3r!!! Metis n3v3r!!!
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deathdearler1
- Newbie Helper
- Posts: 464
- Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 1:02 pm
- Location: somewhere in the great land of KS
ok guys your really starting to beat a dead horse here. not alot can be done about some of the pk's if it isn't seen as it happens. if the dm's start getting involved in every little matter you have to understand that basically it all comes down to your word against theirs......and ultimately no one wants to ban somebody just because you say so. it just doesn't work that way. all you can really do is give someone the info so that they can be on the lookout for it the next time it happens and maybe catch them in the act. other than that you just have to live with it.
when death comes for you and you are not afraid, if he asks why tell him you met me
Very succinctly put, deathdealer; thank you. It's not that we don't care, because believe me, we've had one of the longer discussions we ever had on this very topic recently in the DM forums. Policies are being looked at, changes are happening.
The problem is that some people want us to care too much. Random PKing is in bad taste and isn't fair, but it's not against the rules, and if DMs spent just a couple minutes investigating every complaint that came across the DM Channel or Shout nowadays, it would turn into a neverending job. There are always people in need of real help: people have stuck characters, flawed inventories, bugs, and other things that never seem to end themselves, along with which we try to get in as many quests and Divine Requests as we can (I can honestly say I've never refused a prayer to Lolth, even if you got a bit more than you prayed for
).
If there is legitimate rule-breaking or concrete griefing, like using a bug during PvP or spawn-camping, then we DMs come in on our celestial-template white horses and wipe it out. But if someone just kills you for the sake of killing you, you don't need a DM, or even the Shout channel. All you need to do is avoid them. Neversummer is a bewilderingly huge place if you actually explore, and there are dozens of areas people almost never go but will offer XP for people well into their 20s. Every town has at least two exits; they can't be at the same place at once. And if someone's camping an area, we'll get involved; but if they're just happening along Silver Road for several minutes, try something like hunting on the mountain for a few minutes until they get bored and wander away.
You'll save the DMs, the other players on Shout, and yourself a lot of headache in the long run.
/rant {if long, then 'end'}
# - {if too long, then 'tough!'}
The problem is that some people want us to care too much. Random PKing is in bad taste and isn't fair, but it's not against the rules, and if DMs spent just a couple minutes investigating every complaint that came across the DM Channel or Shout nowadays, it would turn into a neverending job. There are always people in need of real help: people have stuck characters, flawed inventories, bugs, and other things that never seem to end themselves, along with which we try to get in as many quests and Divine Requests as we can (I can honestly say I've never refused a prayer to Lolth, even if you got a bit more than you prayed for
).If there is legitimate rule-breaking or concrete griefing, like using a bug during PvP or spawn-camping, then we DMs come in on our celestial-template white horses and wipe it out. But if someone just kills you for the sake of killing you, you don't need a DM, or even the Shout channel. All you need to do is avoid them. Neversummer is a bewilderingly huge place if you actually explore, and there are dozens of areas people almost never go but will offer XP for people well into their 20s. Every town has at least two exits; they can't be at the same place at once. And if someone's camping an area, we'll get involved; but if they're just happening along Silver Road for several minutes, try something like hunting on the mountain for a few minutes until they get bored and wander away.
You'll save the DMs, the other players on Shout, and yourself a lot of headache in the long run.
/rant {if long, then 'end'}
# - {if too long, then 'tough!'}
~DM Yonwe
Lolth - Goddess of the Drow
Velsharoon - God of Undeath
Lolth - Goddess of the Drow
Velsharoon - God of Undeath
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Terminal Insanity
- Newbie Helper
- Posts: 348
- Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2003 1:24 pm
- Location: I am Jacks hate.
I've been away for the past week so i never got to read the replies, i saw a PM that asked "are you trying to tell us you are breaking NS rules?"
No, when i made that compairison with preschoolers to get the cops to come, it was ment to be compaired to getting the NS-Aligned players to come to the rescue
No, when i made that compairison with preschoolers to get the cops to come, it was ment to be compaired to getting the NS-Aligned players to come to the rescue
.