Rule question concerning PvP

[BaconStrip]

KIll him I say! Baconstrip sounds like some of the other whiners of late. I have been in areas and usually leave others alone, but on occasion I'll demand some sort of "toll" for getting by me. Usually 100 gp or something mundane like that.

So far the 5-6 times I've done that i have gotten the "pike-off" reply. A couple of more resouceful fellows turned in ivis and scurried away. In these two cases I left them a couple of nice magic items and vacated the area. The others that I did kill if they didnt whine about it i would leave something too.

Point is, if you state your intention, "the ball's now in his/her court". Much better then some of the crummy little sneak attacks other have perped on me.

Gaston (BoC)

LOL, toll, gimme a few more levels and you get the middle finger of death to that one.

[Accelerator]

In my OPINION it boils down to common sense and courtesy. Unfortunately everybody's idea of what common sense and common courtesy mean differ greatly. Then there are those that have neither, which is sad. They ruin the game for others and simply don't care.

That being said, here is some common sense and common courtesy: Just because PvP is allowed does NOT mean you need to go around killing everyone that is hostile to you.

[AndrewCarr]

This guy says he was roleplaying his character, I say, yeah right. Being evil doesn't give you the right to prey on newbies, otherwise every would-be griefer would just play an evil character.

No, they'd still be true neutral. No extra dmg from +blahblah vs good/evil, no worries about auras vs alignment. Can multiclass to virtually anything. And they can kill good and evil alignments in equal measure, leading to much more pk'ing

[Qui]

Eh, bacon, who is to say what griefing is? griefing, as best i can tell is in SERIOUS need of a hard definition on NS4. It being a pvp server you have to watch out for people just whining about hwo they are being griefed when ina ctuality it is just normal pvp, and vice versa. PLEASE Joran and other Devs drop a hard definition of griefing and the pvp rules you want us to follow.. and not some of the thigns some other DMs have said about what is considered not rude, or nice, but the hard rules. i think situations have shown how immensly necessary this is.

[Agent Shiny]

so what is the official rule then

[BaconStrip]

Eh, bacon, who is to say what griefing is? griefing, as best i can tell is in SERIOUS need of a hard definition on NS4. It being a pvp server you have to watch out for people just whining about hwo they are being griefed when ina ctuality it is just normal pvp, and vice versa. PLEASE Joran and other Devs drop a hard definition of griefing and the pvp rules you want us to follow.. and not some of the thigns some other DMs have said about what is considered not rude, or nice, but the hard rules. i think situations have shown how immensly necessary this is.

Probably a good idea.

[mumoogaipan]

Whoa, i think this is kind of a silly issue when a: dying from a character doesnt take xp or b: gold. Secondly, you are probably right it isnt good to make a habitual act of Pking people in general but we must remember thye overarching setup of the NEW NS4. It is factional war, meaning there is a heavy inclination to have PK occur. However in this specific case i wouldnt consider the pk and issue. Why? fore several reasons. 1) The higher level knightwing asked a question "tell me location of die." Now this is a freaky situation if your a lower level character. But chances are if the novice would have answered by stating "um.... i really dont know, please dont kill me." I dont think this issue would have come up. and knightwing would probably not have killed the novice. Secondly, i think people are too attatched to their characters and never want them to die. Which is an interesting attitude to have in a factional war server. Additionally, people should let go of the mentatlity that their character is sacred and deserves to be elevated. This is just not true. Yes everyone should get the chance to become very special on the server and have 40 lvl characters but that just wont happen for eeryone. Deal with it. Just the brass tacks of reality. Lastly, being a lower level character means you should be in constant fear of higher level characters and the natural enemies of the NS4 environment. That is what it is like in any low level situation.

All in all, i think players should not become so attatched to their characters in game and they should not complain about the pking. Mainly because there is no real disadvantage to being killed. In addition to not having your character really killed; the character can't lose xp or gold to pk's. Also, Dm's shouldn't create definitive rules on this subject. If they do and start to interpret what is legal and not in the world of NS4 it would just create more chaos. Besides most people dont go around trolling for newb heads to collect, even the okies. And if you happen to be the unfortunate to die by another higher level character, you should revel in the fact that you just got a free transport into town ^_^.

[Firkraag]

Jesbus, People ITS FREAKING BETA..... Bacon this is not the finial MOD, when finished most likely the HIGH lvl people will be in the HIGH lvl AREAS... If you ever played NS3 most if not all high lvls hung out in Cloud City and Lost Paradice. You noobs as you call your self need to understand that all of the problems with griefing 80% will go away when the epic areas r in to test.

Also with beta YOUR CHARS. are going to be WIPED you can count on that. So quit this debat on this issue its been done hundred fold and get down to testing so we can play the finial version. And I already know the responce to this "well the low lvls cant test because you get PKed all the time.....Well thats crap... You all bring this crap to the forums is what is turning the player base away.. In game it is not as bad as what a few of you loud mouth Forum posters are making it. THIS issue is dead and really not a problem get over it. I DID.

[BaconStrip]

Secondly, i think people are too attatched to their characters and never want them to die.

Meh... What I think is interesting is that in the "class changes" thread, people are promoting nerfs of class combinations citing roleplaying reasons. But in the same breath, you guys say don't complain about getting pked because you shouldn't be that attached to your character anyway(a prerequisite to roleplaying). The irony is staggering.

But whatever.... This topic is dead.

[mumoogaipan]

Baconstrip, i think you need to 1) stay on point to the subject at hand which is wether or not it is okay to PK a mouthy player who is effortless. secondly, i think your last point would be great if you could provide me quotes from that thread where i said i support nerfs. Or that anyone this thread supports the nerfs. Personally, i think the nerfs are good on a RP reason. HOWEVER, i believe that for reasons of play balance my feelings on nerfing certain classes SHOULD NOT be implemented. The major point is that Firkraag is correct in that no body should be so upset in the Beta test about characters dying. Also, Firkraag is correct that the actual PKing isnt that bad, but a few forum people chose to exacerbate the point to make it seem as if the issue is really big. I believe this is called making mountains out of mole hills. ^_^

[Sandman-k [sirname Blake]]

the thing i hate is when a high lvl uses the excuss that "you attacked me first" meaning your little lvl 1 summons attacked him and he decided to kill you for it

[Elora Dannan]

Knightwing4 writes:

Hey, i've been looking for a certain area, and, being evil, i found a newbie, and said tell me or die (RP-wise). However, saying he didn't know, he said that if he did know, he wouldn't tell me, because i'm not allowed to carry out my threat, and i'd be reported for greifing followed by a ban/etc., thus my 2 questions:

A) Can i kill newbs who are asking for it (not actually asking for it, but taunting me into it, saying they are protected by the law/DMs etc etc "hahaha")
B) Is what i did considered griefing thus deserving of a severe punishment etc. (because the guy is gonna send in the screenshots of my chat and is saying that's i'm gonna be severly punished)

So in Knightwing4's defense this is what I have to say...

Ok, what I understand about RP is that you are supposed to play your character like you would in real life, but if you were living in this kind of world.

Right?

So, think about it this way...if I was a "Freshman" nerd and I was standing in the hall and a "Senior" football player came up to me and demanded that I tell him what he wants to know or he would beat me up, and I decided to give him some attitude back, I would probably get the sh*t beat out of me.

Right?

Well, that is basically what will happen, 9 out of 10 times in real life.

So who is to truly say he wasn't really RPing. I would have done the same thing. People actually RP sometimes. WHAT A CONCEPT!!

[/quote]

[EvanFallen]

I just don't get it... Where are all of these evil PK'ers that I hear about? If some dude that reads impossible to me runs towards me, I run like hell in the opposite direction. If the bad & ugly PK'er kills me, I will politely ask for a rez. When I first entered server four looking for Avendell, I tried to kill someone of a different faction and lost. I respawned, walked all the way back and promptly ran into four more dudes who thought it would be cool to chase the stubby little dwarf into town. I never complained, I just accepted that the world of NS is a bit scary, and sometimes bad things will happen to you. It adds to the server's flavor.

Getting PK'ed is more of a nuisance than anything. You don't lose XP or gold. The only excuse for not wanting to respawn is if you are far from home.

[mumoogaipan]

well put. You are correct Evanfallen, this is a server that is scary for new pc's. And even mid ranged pc's can run into a few snags every once and a while. But that is what makes a game fun. People should just live with the fact that Pkers exist. This is a game, your character doesn't get deleted when they die. And you dont lose anything. All you have to do is walk back to where you previously where. I think that people use their novice or "effortless" label as a defence when that is just silly. In factional war all people which are not a part of your allies are targets. It is just courtesy that the High lvl characters dont kill the low level ones. That is it, the role everyone is placed into when we join the server states we will be fighting one another and there shouldn't be an expectation by the players to believe that there is a neutral area or places where characters have sanctuary (except for their allies hometown of course ^_^) All in all, just learn to deal with that aspect of playing NS4.

[Lokey]

Secondly, i think people are too attatched to their characters and never want them to die.

Meh... What I think is interesting is that in the "class changes" thread, people are promoting nerfs of class combinations citing roleplaying reasons. But in the same breath, you guys say don't complain about getting pked because you shouldn't be that attached to your character anyway(a prerequisite to roleplaying). The irony is staggering.

But whatever.... This topic is dead.

I'd like to point out that those that don't RP at all seem much more attached to their characters/stuff. In RP the character is the means for fun not the end, but that doesn't explain the attitudes we generally see.