Spike growth, Entangle, and Vine mine

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Eldaquen
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Posts: 358
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 11:48 am

Spike growth, Entangle, and Vine mine

Post by Eldaquen »

Entangle, spike growth, and vine mine.

These three spells have been disabled for some time. I understand reason for the disabling, and do not want to see a class suffer due to how one of the three was used to the detreminte of Dev's hard work. I humbly wish to submit ideas to re-implement these in a different manner so they will not cause issues with NS4's AI. I know what I am about to put forth is not PnP nor 3.5 rules, however NS4 is an unique place that does not always follow PnP rules when it benefits NS4 and those that enjoy playing here.

Starting with Spike Growth a 3rd level druid spell. Bioware implemented so the spell covers the terrain with small spikes. I believe this is the root cause of the spell causing the AI issue. So propose it be changed to a ranged attack causing 1 time damage to a single target, similar as Quillfire does now.
Role play reason or new description: spikes or thorns grow under the victum's skin inflicting piercing damage as they grow outward.

To balance out damage change to 1d4 piercing damage plus 1d4 pierce per 2 caster levels. Maximun damage to be determined by spell focuses as outlined below:
No focus: Maximum pierce damage 40
Spell focus: Maximum pierce damage 50
Greater spell focus: Maximum pierce damage 60
Epic Spell focus: Maximum pierce damage 80

A level progression of damage for a non focused druid caster follows:
Caster level ..................Damage in pierce..........Maximum damage (assuming max roll)
......................................................................No Focus.....Focus.........Greater......Epic
5..................................2d4..............................8................8................8................8
6..................................3d4..............................12..............12..............12..............12
8..................................4d4..............................16..............16..............16..............16
10................................5d4..............................20..............20..............20..............20
12................................6d4..............................24..............24..............24..............24
14................................7d4..............................28..............28..............28..............28
16................................8d4..............................32..............32..............32..............32
18................................9d4..............................36..............36..............36..............36
20................................10d4............................40..............40..............40..............40
22................................11d4............................40..............44..............44..............44
24................................12d4............................40..............48..............48..............48
26................................13d4............................40..............50..............52..............52
28................................14d4............................40..............50..............56..............56
30................................15d4............................40..............50..............60..............60
32................................16d4............................40..............50..............60..............64
34................................17d4............................40..............50..............60..............68
36................................18d4............................40..............50..............60..............72
38................................19d4............................40..............50..............60..............76
40................................20d4............................40..............50..............60..............80

If changed as outlined above, the negative affect to AI (AoE affect) would no longer occur. The damage as outlined above is not unbalanced because the damage type is of one type (pierce). Also, in order to acheive maximum damage the druid would need to be focus on being a caster forgoing multi-classing reducing discipline, saves, AB, AC, etc. Finally since only dealing pierce the damage dealt would be subject to the armor and shield protection of the damage receipent.

Examples:
Pure level 40 druid, who is epic focused in conjure would have potential damage with this change of: 20d4 pierce or a maximum of 80 points per cast. If the opponent is using a Ragnar's Burial shield the maximum damage they would receive is reduced by the shields 25% pierce immunity and 20 pierce reduction. In this example if max roll of 80 pierce damage was dealt then the immunity would absorb 20 points, the reduction would absorb 20 points leaving only 40 points of damage dealt. Yes if the opponent is not using pierce protection the potential is maximum of 80 pierce. However, due to the number of archers about, most players have pierce protection readily available.

A druid with only 20 caster levels would only be able to do 10d4 pierce damage. Even if epic focused in conjure. If cast against the same opponent using Ragnar's burial shield, the opponent's shield would absorb 30 points of pierce damage leaving only 10 pierce damage dealt against their hps.

A druid with only 32 caster levels pierce damage would be 16d4 pierce damage, a maximum of 64 pierce damage. Against the same opponent and shield, the shield would absorb 36 pierce damage leaving 28 pierce damage dealt.

The above is not unbalanced because only 1 damage type dealt, maximums are reasonable, max rolls are infrequent in game, and there are plenty of pierce protection options available to all builds in NS4.

Epic Damage reduction, Epic mage armor, Earth gen token, Barbarian Damage reduction, Dwarven Defender reduction, stone skin, greater stone skin, and premontion would all reduce the damage received if the dev's accept this proposal. Further balancing the spell.

I am working on alternate options for Vine mine and entangle. Hope to have ideas posted soon.
Murphy's Law:
Nothing is as easy as it looks.
Everything takes longer than you expect.
And if anything can go wrong,
It will, at the worst possible moment.

Amoenotep
Lord DM Supreme
Posts: 4717
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:09 pm
Location: in the mists of eternity

Re: Spike growth, Entangle, and Vine mine

Post by Amoenotep »

should be in ns4 boards?
Mask, Lord of the Shadows
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Eldaquen
Newbie Helper
Posts: 358
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 11:48 am

Re: Spike growth, Entangle, and Vine mine

Post by Eldaquen »

whoops
Murphy's Law:
Nothing is as easy as it looks.
Everything takes longer than you expect.
And if anything can go wrong,
It will, at the worst possible moment.

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